Bob's yr uncle :: 2005 MINI Cooper S

Discussion in 'Member Garages' started by Dennis Bratland, Aug 29, 2016.

  1. Dennis Bratland

    Dennis Bratland New Member

    Aug 28, 2016
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    Bob's yr uncle :: 2005 MINI Cooper S (2016-08-29 00:05:34)
     
  2. Dave.0

    Dave.0 Helix & RMW Powered
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    Save your ECU and get rid of the MSD coil pack. Your ECU will thank you by not burning up.
     
  3. MCS02

    MCS02 Moderator
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    Nice Mini! Nothing better than a R53! So I have to agree with Dave agin stock coil pack is all I will put on my Mini.
     
  4. 00Mini

    00Mini Well-Known Member

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    Nice looking first generation S !!
     
  5. Dennis Bratland

    Dennis Bratland New Member

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    So what happened was, for several years -- about 4 years? -- my R50 had a check engine light and P0300 codes. The dealer, and Fat City European Auto Repair , tried more than once to diagnose why, or at least make it stop. The dealer told me once it was because I wasn't using the exact OE plugs. I think I was using NGK replacements, but it didn't matter. Then they said it was the coil. I had found corrosion on the #3 terminal, and replaced the coil, but then they said it was because I was using a Beru coil. I had them install whatever brand coil that they (superstitiously) thought was the only one you could use. Which, of course, made no difference.

    I think it was at this point that I got the MSD only because it has brass terminals and maybe that would fix it, but I never got around to installing it, and they finally figured out that it was a bigger problem than coils or plugs. Their last theory was out of round cylinders. It continued to get the check engine light for a while -- 500 miles? -- but now it has stopped, at least for the last 800 miles or so. It used to have a check engine light appear any time you drove for more than 20 minutes, often sooner.

    So about this time, the R53 I was searching for appeared, and I bought it. The only thing wrong with this 24,900-mile, 11-year old car, due to being parked a little too much, was mice chewing on the hood insulation and one of the plug wires, which had been patched with silicone. So I put on some NGK wires because they were blue, like the car, and didn't cost more. And I installed the MSD coil I had, because it had brass terminals.

    And... the previous owner of the R53 told me he had the exact same P0300 problem, and the dealer could never figure it out. Finally he went to a small independent garage in the neighborhood, and the guy found a very small head gasket leak. Replaced the gasket and the problem never came back. So if the R50 starts doing it again I'm going to do a leakdown test and probably try a head gasket.

    I've heard a lot about problems with the MSD, but I've never seen an explanation for how or why it could damage the ECU. I know about the pitfalls of connector pins that don't match, and punching holes in your valve cover with the wrong screws tightened too far. I haven't seen reports of problems where these two issues were not conflated with some other damage attributed to the MSD.

    Why does it damage the ECU?
     
  6. MCS02

    MCS02 Moderator
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    Someone here can correct me if I am wrong but I believe it is due to the power out put of the coil. There is really no advantage to a MSD coil pack.
     
  7. Dennis Bratland

    Dennis Bratland New Member

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    I went ahead and put the old coil back on while I was installing auxiliary lights today. It doesn't make sense that the coil's power output could damage the ECU. The output could harm the wires or plugs if it was excessive, but the high voltage side is only 5 or 10% more than stock anyway. Could be the load on the low-tension side is too high, and that maybe could hurt the ECU. That seems more a matter of defective coil circuitry than a coil that's too powerful.

    I suppose it's possible that the BMW wasn't playing around when they mounted the coil on rubber dampers. Unlike, say, when they clearly were playing around attaching the wheel well trim with no less than six distinct type of fasteners. They're still laughing about that one.

    But the soft coil mount might actually serve a purpose, and the MSD coil maybe starts to degrade from the undamped vibration, and maybe that leads to overloading the 12v side of the windings. Just a theory.

    Also got the Smith's gauges mounted, in a janky kind of way. The oil pressure/water temp and boost are working fine. I really like how mechanical gauges work independently of the car's electrics. The clock and voltmeter aren't doing anything yet, and none of the gauges are lit. I have a lot of stuff to take apart to wire up the lights I just put in, so that's a good time to run wires to the gauges. Eventually I'll move the voltmeter and clock down to the center console, when I find a panel for them, leaving only the other two next to the tach. Also have white gauge faces on the way.

    Milltek exhaust is down at Performance Coatings getting ceramic coated to keep the heat in. That's another big job waiting for me when it's done. Oh, and I have a cravenspeed 15% pulley, belt, and colder plugs sitting there. But I really should be working on my R50 so I can sell that one off.
     
  8. MCS02

    MCS02 Moderator
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    I know when I had BMWs they were very flaky about power. If you put the wrong type of lights in them they would do all sorts of odd stuff. My sons 325i had high power HD in it. when you would turn on the lights the RPM gauge and speedo needles would go to the bottom of the scale for a few seconds. once I replaced them with stock ones the problem went away. So I can just imagine what the MSD coil pack could do. Besides you are going to get 0 performance gain from it.
     
  9. Dennis Bratland

    Dennis Bratland New Member

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    I think the answer is found in here somewhere:

    http://www.dtec.net.au/Ignition%20Coil%20Dwell%20Calibration.htm

    Scroll down to "2. Mapped dwell (ECU has actual control of the dwell)". I don't know very much about what MSD has done with their coil pack, whether they use a design that actually differnet from stock, or just more wingdings. And how they compensate for the ECU cutting off voltage when it detects that it has exceeded the expected value. If they compensate.

    Also, MSD says their p/n 8239 coil puts out a maximum of 36,000 volts.

    https://www.msdperformance.com/products/coils/performance_street/parts/8239

    Vendors like Jegs and Mini Mania and Summit Racing all use MSD's number, which is no better than the stock voltage. The only place I can find that claims a higher voltage is Out Motoring, saying it's 40,000 volts. All the other specifications match MSDs numbers, but the voltage is listed as more for some reason. I shot Out Motoring a question asking where they got the 40,000 volts figure. And why they tell you two different ways of installing it.

    Anyhow, I used the MSD for other reasons, but there are other ways to avoid corrosion on the terminals, so I don't have a reason to mess with it.
     

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