Engine Damage due to Detonation

Discussion in 'Starting Line - New Member Introductions' started by ingrid926, Jan 3, 2017.

  1. ingrid926

    ingrid926 New Member

    Dec 19, 2016
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    Hello,
    I'm new to the forum. My daughter's 2007 Mini Cooper S was recently in the shop for a new valve cover and breather. She drove the car less than 40 miles or so and her car began shuddering, etc. engine light blinking and came on. I had the car towed back to the shop and they told me that she ran out of gas and this caused the plug to go bad and now there is no compression in cylinder 1. Is this possible? She didn't actually run out of gas as she was able to get the car home. I ran the diagnostics and it shows cylinders 1 - 3 misfiring with a pending misfire code on cylinder 4. If it was a fuel problem, wouldn't the car have simply run out of gas? I was also told that plug 1 is the last to get fuel. If that's the case, then why didn't cylinder 4 fail? Please help as I really don't want to get ripped off. Thanks in advance!
     
  2. DneprDave

    DneprDave Well-Known Member
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    MINIs are very sensitive about running out of gas, they are not the carburetted cars of the past. Running out of gas usually wrecks the fuel pump, as it is cooled by the fuel going through it. Running out of fuel could also case a lean condition that would overheat the cylinders and melt a piston, I'm not saying that's what happened, but it is possible.

    I don't ever run my MINI's fuel tank down to the red warning light, the MINI's gas gage is not very accurate, I usually get gas when it is just below half on the gage.
     
  3. ingrid926

    ingrid926 New Member

    Dec 19, 2016
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    Hi Dave,

    Thanks for your quick reply. My daughter did not run out of gas though. She actually was able to drive the car home and the flatbed driver who picked up the car to take it back to the shop where work had just been done, was able to start the car and pull it out of the driveway to line it up to put it on the truck.

    I honestly believe that they did not repair something properly and they are giving me this story to try and place blame elsewhere.

    I'm having the car flat bedded to another mechanic now for a second opinion.

    Thanks,
    Ingrid
     
  4. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    Yeah I don't think it's possible to smoke a motor running out of gas, I've never heard of that in my life... It's not like your pre mixing gas.

    They prolly didn't fully seat a circlip or something in piston 1 and it come apart. I'd take it to a second shop for diagnosis for sure.
     
  5. caseydog

    caseydog Well-Known Member

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    My BS alarm is going off, too. Even if she did run out of gas, I can't see any way for that to toast an engine.

    A second opinion is definitely in order. There is a strong possibility the first shop messed up, and is deflecting responsibility.

    Since your name is Ingrid, I also suspect the first shop is trying to pull a "woman" scam on you, figuring you'd buy whatever story they told you.:frown2:

    CD
     
  6. MCS02

    MCS02 Moderator
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    Yea I don't think so. Yes it may be posable but so are flying monkeys! I hate monkeys especially the flying kind, but I digress. Get a second opinion.

    Welcome to MA!
     
  7. Dave.0

    Dave.0 Helix & RMW Powered
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    Yeah I agree with the above replies. BS on the dealership.
     
  8. Friskie

    Friskie Well-Known Member

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    #8 Friskie, Jan 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2017
    No indication where you are from so here is a link you can use to find a decent BMW/MINI shop in your area. To further identify a reliable one, check the 'Clubs' link on the above menu bar to find a club near you. They'll know who to trust.
    http://www.minirepairshops.com/
     
  9. Minidave

    Minidave Well-Known Member
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    The OP's post is very confusing to me, first it says the car was detonating, then in the body of the post it says a plug failed due to running out of gas - those are two completely separate and not conjoined issues - so what really happened?

    She said the car was shuddering - that could be a miss due to plug misfire or injector failure, or it could be symptomatic of a detonation caused miss.

    Running out of gas would not make the engine "ping or detonate", the wrong fuel could....and she says the car was not out of gas. But do you say that only because the engine continued to run or did the gauge show fuel in the tank?

    It's all very confusing at this point......absent a more accurate description of events the only thing I can suggest is get it to a shop you trust who works on and knows MINIs, then see what they say.

    It sounds to me like it lost a valve.
     
  10. MCS02

    MCS02 Moderator
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    The shop told her that her daughter ran out of gas and that caused the problem, she said it did not run out of gas. I believe the shop is trying to blam her daughter for the problem. I just hope we hear how it ends.
     
  11. Goldsmithy

    Goldsmithy MINI Alliance Ambassador
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    Was this at a dealership or private shop? Either was a cause to run far and fast away from them. Good advice given above...and welcome to M/A. It would help to know the model and mileage of the car.
     
  12. Qik

    Qik Well-Known Member

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    I'm confused. How is cylinder/plug 1 the last to get fuel? Every firing order starts with 1, no? Also, your shop sounds sketchy. Is it an import shop or an everything shop? Is there any ASE master techs employed there? Touching on the lack of fuel they're talking about, it is possible there is an issue with your high pressure fuel pump. When they start to go they do some funky stuff but mine did throw a code. Keep in mind the car you're working with has an N14, kill it with fire and move on.
     
  13. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    1342..... The story you are being given smells like a fish to me. If you give us your location someone may be able to point you to a reputable shop with knowledge of these cars. Good luck.
     
  14. Metalman

    Metalman Well-Known Member
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    I'm thinking the mechanic is sitting inside the MINI so to him it would be 2431....... Bruhahahahaha:D
     
  15. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    Maybe a special coating would help things?

    [​IMG]

    Back on topic.....

    [​IMG]
     
  16. Alan

    Alan Active Member

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    I think the mechanic meant cylinder 1 is at the end of the intake manifold. I have no idea if that is true for an R56.
     
  17. Metalman

    Metalman Well-Known Member
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    In the old days this was a concern with carburetors causing possible fuel starvation with some intake runners resulting in a lean mixture in certain cylinders....

    The only way (maybe) this would apply to the DI fuel injected engines would be if one cylinder was getting more air to a given amount of fuel causing it to run lean.... Don't know if this is the case with cylinder #1. DI engines are set up to run lean.

    With the carbon buildup on the R56 DI engines, I imagine cylinders #2,3 &4 would need more carbon restrictions being built up more than on cylinder #1 for a lean issue to occur. Since the oxygen sensor is looking for an average to make fuel ratio adjustments, #1 could be running lean.... In this scenario....

    Time for some added walnuts....:idea:
     
  18. Zapski

    Zapski Well-Known Member

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    I have a 2008 Cooper S and just replaced the valve cover and PVC Vent Hose myself a couple of months ago, and I'm a newbie in the mechanical range of things. It's not a hard repair, and if a n00b like me can do it successfullly without messing things up, then that dealer royally botched it.

    I call shenanigans.
     
  19. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    I though detonation was was cause by timing being off or octane being off as in spark knock. Lean condition I though would burn valves & piston crowns. Something is fishy.
     
  20. Dave.0

    Dave.0 Helix & RMW Powered
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    It's an R56 so the answer could be anything.

    Have you tried consulting this?

    [​IMG]

    I am sure this will be the answer.

    [​IMG]
     

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