2nd Gen Guapish Fliver - "Tha build"

Discussion in 'Car Builds, Projects, Idea's Experiments' started by Guapish_Fliver, Jun 1, 2016.

  1. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #1 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 1, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2016
    Ok so I decided to start a build thread and share my saga. I do not have the patience to sit here and complete the entire thing in one sitting so I'll update the thread in increments over the next few weeks until I reach my current state. Plus It's riding season so give me some time and I'll try to be as detailed as possible. I'll still probably end up leaving some stuff out.

    Chapter 1

    A little history:

    2007 n14 manual. No sunroof.

    ** Purchased the vehicle with 65k miles for cheap. Vehicle felt solid and ran/idled smooth initially, had a little bit of a timing rattle when the revs dropped to idle or when it was cold but given the price of the vehicle I was fine with that. I don't mind turning wrenches. Suspension felt/feels good, and the car already had a clutch put in (lol) so I did the deal and drove it 1500 miles home. Tires were whack so I put some Pirelli all seasons on it. The car would see snow so I figured I'll get a different set of wheels for the summer later.

    After driving the car for a while, I noticed it sucked oil pretty bad. Not too bad at this point but still pretty bad as I remember. I also noticed under heavy load in high gear pulling up a hill the car would ping terribly. Like a lean ping. I would let my foot off the gas immediately and the car would recover like nothing happened. I was like whoa. I've cracked cylinder jugs riding dirt bikes detonating before so I knew that I had to get this issue taken care of immediately. The problem was intermittent but there for sure.

    I did a dry compression check and all cylinders came back good within 1 psi of each other. The numbers were a bit low but I dismissed it as a cold engine/dry cylinders, and high altitude.

    I also ran injector cleaner, and changed plugs and coils (oem). All plugs looked identical. The car had never thrown a cel so I figured it wasn't a fuel pressure problem but fuel air ratio problem. I decided in my mind that the detonation was due to oil getting into the combustion chamber and fouling my mix. It made sense because the pings/detonation would always be accompanied by a puff of oil looking smoke and the car would instantly recover. I imagined the scenario would initially suck some oil, ping, knock sensors would emergency fuel cut, and computer would instantly retard timing and compensate. Who knows if this was actually happening but it was what was playing out in my mind from the conditions felt. This detonation and recovery would all occur within less than 1 second. Very quickly. Always under WOT at varying rpms and intermittently. Never 2 times in a row. The car would idle smoothly and run fine as long as it wasn't driven hard.

    So, I set about finding out how I'm getting oil in the cylinders. I checked the pcv line going into the intake manifold and noticed a good amount of oil. I thought maybe it would pool in the manifold and suck into the cylinders under high load. Made sense. So I changed the pcv cover with the "updated" part number. This did absolutely nothing. Moving forward, I decided to try and plug the rear pcv port and run the bsh catch can, it still didn't work. This actually had an adverse effect. The car actually smoked more and consumed more oil with the rear plug blocked. So I sold the catch can, returned the pcv setup to stock configuration, and moved on to the next issue.

    During the initial ownership period, (all within 3k miles) I noticed that the car had developed a puff of smoke after extended idle periods and zero throttle coasting situations. This developed like clockwork after idle the car would always smoke. I checked the turbo shaft and did notice a bit of play. I figured that the pcv may have failed and clogged my cat, thus killing the pressure seals in the turbo due to back pressure.

    At this point I just wanted to get all the repairs out of the way and have the car running properly. I didn't care about mods/tunes. So I ordered a refurb Jcw turbo from jmtc with no tune, and also had to order a new Jcw hard pipe. Nothing I could do would make the oem intake fit on the Jcw turbo. I tried and tried, cussed and spit, until I broke tha damn thing. I installed heat sleeved oil lines, drained coolant, changed plugs again, cleaned all the oil out of the intercooler and intake, put everything back together, removed all my cats, did a Riss racing 2.5 dp, kept the stock muffler, and proceeded to set about my way with the exhaust cel lit for a bit.

    New turbo changed nothing. Again. It may have boosted a little harder than the oem turbo but not even anything I could notice. This car was still a complete dog off the bottom, it would run real fat in the middle and boost hard then fall on its face at the top. If I were to compare it to carbeurators it was running like it had a lean main or something. It had nothing for me on the upper end of the powerband, forcing me to shift early to feel like I was going anywhere.

    It was still intermittently detonating. Still smoking after idles constantly. My oil consumption had increased beyond anything I've ever seen before. It was amazing. Like a quart or so every 500 miles. The smoke pulling away from long stop lights was embarrassing. I was like wow. I knew I had issues fu sho.

    Next step I figured it has to be guides or valve train issues or something. It was at this point I knew the car was going to be down and I was going to be spending some Guap. Engine had to be torn apart. Long story short, turns out the head was trashed (bad guides, severe carbon) as well as the cylinders tapered/oval.

    Pistons were fine although the crowns were hella dirty. The bad cylinders meant the pan had to be dropped and block sent off to the machine shop for the oversized 77.5 mm Pistons. All of the conditions were related to long oil change intervals or incorrect oil. The cylinders could have ovaled because of detonation. I really don't know. The vehicle was never overheated according to stored codes.

    I imagine the previous owner got the oil changed every 15k at some ham fisted monkey gas station mechanic. That would be my guess on the cylinders. The valves had never been walnut blasted so idk if the insane amount of carbon had anything to do with trashing my guides.

    Anywho, this gave me an exquisite opportunity to get my mod list going. I'll go over my mod decisions and why I made them next post.

    To be continued....

    Pic of the little pig when new. :prrr:

    (I only know how to attach 1 pic at a time so maybe someone can pm me on how to compile multiple pics in a single post. That would help)
     

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  2. old81

    old81 Club Coordinator
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    I do love it when a plan comes together, buy MINI low, MINI is so F'd up, you rebuild with a plan.

    You followed a good plan for getting the oil problem solved, but some of the N14s were weak and prone to oil consumption, it was hit or miss.

    My 07 was solid, did not consume a drop, I sold it at 55K to get my 16 Countryman, it is still running fine and the folks who own it love it. My 07 was not stock per se and had an RMW tune running for a few years, over 200HP and 264 FT lbs of torque (it was an automatic). It was tracked often. :)

    Good luck.
    Don
    :)
     
  3. DneprDave

    DneprDave Well-Known Member
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    I'm looking forward to the next chapter of your build story.

    I put an oil catch can on my MINI and blocked off the PCV line to the throttle body when it was new. I have had no problem with oil consumption. My MINI burns less than a quart between 5000 mile oil change. I have 32,000 miles on it now and plan on pulling the intake manifold at 50,000 to check for carbon build up on the intake valves. I'll also check the intercooler for oil, That will tell me if the oil catch can is dong its job.
     
  4. Dave.0

    Dave.0 Helix & RMW Powered
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    I am also looking forward to the next chapter of your build.

    Sounds like a great story so far. :popcorn:
     
  5. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #5 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 2, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016

    As an experiment you should measure your exact oil usage and then take the can off for 1 oci and see if it drops for at all.

    My problems were probably exacerbated by other issues but I did notice a fair increase in consumption with the plug blocked.
     
  6. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #6 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 2, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016
    Chapter 2

    Basic engine assembly:

    Now I wanted to keep in mind that this is not an unlimited budget build. If I was going to get insane with numbers I would just go for the M4. I wanted to build this car so that it was comfortably quick using the stock ECU. Not such an ungodly slow piece of **** as it had been conceived into this world. Nothing too insane, but as much "safe power" as possible without a stand alone fuel system, titanium valves, springs, and on and on and on. I mean you can go as far as you want with this stuff, so I didn't want to spend too much more Guap than I spent on the car. That was the rationale in my mind going into this deal.

    After discovering the extent of the internal engine damage the block had to be sent off to be bored and bring ring tolerances back within range. The next size up piston is 77.5 millimeter and I opted for the Supertech forged. I chose these Pistons because they are a "soft" forge, meaning their silicon content is higher. This will resist knock sensor inducing noise and other negative effects induced/associated with cold slap, and other related bad shi*t that result from a "fully forged" piston. If you disable knock sensors to accommodate a fully forged piston it defeats the purpose of having a tough piston entirely. If you power through a ping It does not matter how strong the piston is, detonation will blow up anything. I've blown up wisecos strongest "fully forged" Pistons numerous times with only 50-60hp! That proves that it's not the power, it's cylinder pressures. So I repeat, detonation will blow up ANYTHING. Trust me. The force of such a condition is fascinating indeed. Don't think you'll get away with pre ignition just because you have a stronger piston. For my car I wanted the hardest composition possible without compromising engine safety features. So it goes without saying, it was definitely important for me to keep my knock sensors and emergency fuel cut intact.


    I chose the JCW version Supertech Pistons for reasons of slightly lowering compression in anticipation of big boost in my future. Under the advice of my tuner I was told that these Pistons would most definitely hold up with the power and boost I would be looking at. The objective I had in mind for my build was to create as much "safe" power as possible. This sounds like an oxymoron but I'm deeply emotionally disturbed, as well as financially scarred from blowing up high strung motocross engines repeatedly over the years. Bah!

    FYI: Be forewarned that Supertech does not supply rings with these Pistons. They must be ordered separately. Lmao.

    Next I decided to keep my stock bottom end OEM con rods, bearings, and crank. There are varying opinions regarding this issue across all spectrums so I'll give you my take:

    I had a bunch of Honda buddies trying to convince me that I must go forged. I was, and still am under the conviction that forged rods are overkill and the stock con rods will hold up and outlast most everything, period the end. I could find little or no evidence of people snapping rods that were running well above my target hp for the MINI. My rationale for this in relating to what I've seen with motorcycles, is that I've never in my life snapped a rod. Or seen it with my own eyes. Ever. Those are high strung, high compression, high revving little motors, and I've blown up a metric ton of Pistons for all types of reasons. Listen guys, I've seen the piston disintegrate, disappear like Houdini, be COMPLETELY gone, mulched into dust in the case, and the rod will be fine, just chillin with the pin and a small piece of piston in the mangled cylinder jug just like, "no big thang". I have faith in the structural integrity of rods in general. Maybe some people have had different experiences in life, who knows. Anywho, not to get sidetracked.

    Ive also caught wind that some of the guys that chose to run the Carrillos in the R56 were having block clearance issues. I wanted to avoid that nightmare all together. If I will ever end up regretting this decision to remain oem remains to be seen (Baaha!). Maybe I'm wrong and the forged rods are needed in some auto applications, but as of now the OEM still seem to be doing their thing. I think I'll be fine.

    I opted to leave the remaining bottom end alone as well. I didn't balance the crank as some have. My reasoning was that I do not plan on ringing this cars neck or tracking it at the redline constantly. I'm going to keep this car off the track period. I spend enough money on my off-road "habits", that I don't need any more debilitating racing addictions. In my experience with motorcycle engines the bottom end will well outlast multiple top end rebuilds so I felt I'd be fine just leaving it and moving on.

    Now for the refurb head I decided to give JMTC a try. I also had Cometic make me a beefy head gasket, and of course ordered new rod bolts (oem). I chose the "ported and polished" version head, with hopes of cooler temps and of course more power. I do towing with my car so cooler running temps was a big plus for me. The piece looked good as far as I could tell with my limited experience being able to compare it to anything, and Jmtc was willing to supply me with new cams as my originals had some pitting. The head did have some weird overspray on the threads for the spark plugs that needed a tap to clear them out, but other than that the machine work looked clean.

    I spoke with Aric a TON over the phone, and the dude was always willing to sacrifice extra time to answer all my questions. I like that. Im very picky about who I do business with, it pisses me right off when I can't get a hold of distributors. I am a baby about customer service and having every one of my questions answered before moving forward with something. When I was searching for tuners it was very difficult for me to get people other than installers on the phone. I found JMTC to begin with because of the prices on refurb turbos but decided to come back and stick with him because of the willingness to help.

    From the machine shop the engine went to a local builder to complete the basic engine assembly as this was a little outside of my comfort zone and I wanted to ensure there would be no expensive mistakes. No shame in that lol. Dirt bikes are much more simple and I got scared about doing it myself, so I called around and got the work done for a decent price and let them deal with that part. I also had a new timing chain assembly with the longer tensioner installed. Now I had a complete engine back in the car, with everything the way it was before tear down with the stock tune and Jcw turbo etc....

    Next was the engine break in and getting the exhaust sorted during that time.

    PHEW that's enough for me right now. I didn't think I would get so much done this quickly I don't know what's gotten into me.

    I'll continue next chapter on my engine break in procedures, remaining mods, turbo, exhaust, drone problems, custom stuff, tuning, and my opinions on why. (fart). :arf:

    (I still can only do 1 pic per post, maybe I'll just post a bunch of randoms at the end, that would be easier)

    Here's the head when I got it
     

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  7. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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  8. oldbrokenwind

    oldbrokenwind Active Member

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    Verrrrrry interrrresting. Can't wait for the next chapter.

    What part of "Da wess" are you in?
     
  9. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #9 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 3, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2016
    Chapter 3

    Engine break in procedure:

    I picked the car up let it idle for a minute, shut it off and let it cool, then warmed it back up and drove it home (heat cycle). Then, I decided to drain and fill the gearbox oil because even though it says "lifetime", I don't believe them. 2 ltr of the OEM BMW stuff cost me $100! Woooh, doggy! They consider this to be a very special liquid indeed! The car took just under 2 quarts and I considered consuming the remaining amount myself, thinking that it would some how make me immortal, or that I could potentially gain some superhuman powers from it as well. I certainly didn't want to waste any. Next I ran the engine through break in whilst getting the 3" exhaust sorted.

    DISCLAIMER: I do not claim to be an engine builder, metallurgist, physicist, engineer, or mechanic. I only know what I have seen and observed through many trials and more errors as a punk Moto dude.

    Some people dismiss engine break in procedures as not "necessary" or not a big deal (pfff). Other people go nuts with it relying on old wives tales to accomplish a relatively simple process. I happen to think that a prudent gentleman considers proper break in wise and among top priorities. Bad break in initially very well could have contributed to the laundry list of issues this vehicle had "acquired". The negative effect of neglecting this procedure may not be so apparent immediately but will most definitely result in problems incurred in the macro view down the line.

    Proper ring seating can virtually eliminate oil usage for a duration of the engines life, as well as maintain compression for longer periods. The benefits in regards to physics go beyond my knowledge. I just know it works. I feel that the inconsiderate people who don't care to break in their vehicle properly are just raping it's soul, leaving it to meekly struggle on and die for future owners. This stuff translates to lost hp and loose tolerances further down the road for the little guy. Bad juju. Very bad. Tisk tisk.

    I'm a big believer in heat cycling the motor, then gradually increasing load percentage during the initial break in period whilst keeping rpms lower in the range. I do not open up the motor at all during the initial break in, contrary to some "interesting" beliefs. I've tried many different ways after rebuilding top ends, including some illogical ones like going balls out right away (lol) and they always lost compression quickly that way. Moto engines lives are in dog years so it's easy to see these effects in a shorter timeframe. I've also scratched up fresh cylinders by paying no mind to break in. I have learned this stuff on bikes by witnessing it. I haven't been handed down rhetoric, taught someone's opinion, superstition, or beliefs on this subject. It has been my first hand observation that this is how to do it correctly:

    First it should be noted that although engine load and RPM are related they are two completely different things. I'm speaking of "load" in relation to resistance against the crankshaft. I use percentages to describe the "feel" of the resistance load. A good example would be 5th gear going up a hill in low RPM would equal a high percentage load. Basically load is how much "work" an engines doing, just to clarify before moving forward. I try to keep in mind the engines load percentage during break in and vary throttle inputs accordingly.

    Using the gradual load, low rpm method, I have found that my motorcycle top ends last the longest, beyond 100 hours, well beyond if I'm feeling like a gambler. The physics of motors transcend different platforms so I applied this method to my car. It's very simple.

    -So to review oci and oil, I did 300 miles on the break in oil, another 500 miles on my normal oil, then another change 500-700 miles after that. I first used a regular high zinc break in oil then moved to my normal Liquimoly ACEA rated oil after. (Big fan of the stuff).

    Multiple heat cycles are important I believe. Whether you want to measure these cycles while increasing load with mileage or time is up to the individual. I think time is more accurate, but mileage is easier in this case.

    -To start, zero load idle heat cycle to normal operating temp, no longer. Keep it short then shut off and let cool completely. Then no more than 20% engine load first 300 miles. No more than 40% load for next 500 miles. Next 500 miles no more than 75% or 3/4 throttle, still being mindful of keeping RPMs below half of redline. Some low rpm, high gear 75% pulling is good I think. After that gradual progression around 1500 miles, or whenever the initial 75% stage is complete, I feel it's a good thing to flog it WOT. Rev the piss out of it at this point. That clears it out a bit, and seats the rings if there was ever any doubt. There will be no cylinder glazing unless you pussy foot around and wait too long before givin it to er. That's why a good flogging is in order at the END, to prevent such glazing. It is my belief that break in is not complete until you give er hell. Then your broke in.

    Thus, I have given you my tried and true solution to this over opinionated topic. Very simple, nothing crazy, take it or leave it. I think it's the finer details that matter with this kind of stuff.

    MINI's recommended engine break in method in the manual just simplifies this aforementioned procedure in layman's terms so that a complete moron could grasp the subject. They just tell you not to go over 4K rpm for 1300 miles. Lol. Makes sense. :idea:

    Now during this time my exhaust drone was absolutely terrible. Horrendous. Disgusting. Gross. Above all, trashy. I was running the cat less 2.5 DP with the second cat cut out with the stock S muffler left on. So it was basically a straight 2.5 stock exhaust. It was bad to the point my face would tingle upon silence after a long trip. Drone drives me nuts, it always has, other people not so much I guess.

    My tuner advised me that I would need a 3" exhaust to remain as "safe" as possible. So next I set about getting some custom work done as there are not many 3" options out there for the R56. My goal in mind was to "keep it classy" and eliminate some of the tinny rasp and drone.

    That's enough jabbering for today. Patience gone. :crazy:

    Next chapter I'll discuss my exhaust work and piping decisions in preparation for the new tune and turbo etc...
     
  10. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #10 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 19, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2016
    I thought I would post some quick picks of the OEM Pistons around 75k miles before the next chapter. I'm no auto expert but they look pretty gnarly to me. None of the rings were stuck.

    Few things I found interesting:

    -The skirt of the Pistons only wore on one side

    -Where the carbon built up on the Pistons I thought was weird, some of the areas just on the side of the crown look new.

    They are hella dirty, I know the vehicle was burning oil but I've seen 2 stroke Pistons come out cleaner lol.

    The crowns look like angry little hipster moustache faces...

    Comments on these? The pics are all sides in order
     

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  11. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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  12. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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  13. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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  14. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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  15. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    Siiick
     

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  16. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    #16 Guapish_Fliver, Jun 21, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2016
    Alright so on to the exhaust...

    I planned on having a 3" custom downpipe made but the local guys around here trembled in fear of the idea so I had to order one from jmtc as the cnt option is trash.

    We had to grind some length off of the studs because the 3" is bigger to the point it wouldn't allow the nuts on.

    We also had to cut a piece off of the flange so the waste gate rod/pivot arm would clear and the lower bracket had a hard time lining up so I just cut it off. I would call the fitment on the lesser side of marginal...

    The lower heat shield would not fit back on and the stainless pipe is slicker than goose sht, so I couldn't wrap the pipe. I was thinking about maybe using one of those giant Velcro heat sleeves for the lower section as I imagine the lower heat shield is there for a reason...

    The 3 inch still drones but not as bad as the 2.5 believe it or not. It's louder but not so tinny and annoying.

    I tried to fit a tractor muffler in the midsection to help but it hung way too low so it's basically just a straight through type muffler nothing else in there... Not as loud as you would think. I also had all these big plans to try and fit a helmholtz resonator in there but there's simply no room. I believe the 3" sounds better so I gave up on my J pipe idea...

    You can tell from the sound at idle and throughout the rpm range that the Mini is not normal, but it is not obnoxious. Much quieter than expected really.

    I tow with my mini so I had my exhaust guy fab me a sick tip to direct the flow down and away to keep from melting my trailer wires.

    We then sprayed it black so you can not even really see it from behind, I wanted to keep the sleeper steez going on and I feel successful.

    I got the complete system including down pipe done for less than half of the cost of just the Alta 3" cat back system. I thought the Alta price was ludacris.
     

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  17. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    I opted for a clamp on the flex pipe because I wanted to just be able to swing the dp out of the way when replacing turbos
     

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  18. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    Here's my old Riss racing 2.5 downpipe that came with a notch already cut in the flange so we just copied it on the 3"
     

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  19. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    Full system
     

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  20. Guapish_Fliver

    Guapish_Fliver New Member

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    Don't be jealous of my tip...:ihih:
     

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