Been waiting for someone to ask this.The 4th post about Mike Pinson and his review of a couple of cam shafts yet it was mentioned they had not been Tuned yet. My first thought is why not. Does he not want to know exactly what is happening and want to know that he is getting the very most out of each part..With his racing experience I'd think that would be what he is after.. and yes I realize it is not all about peak numbers but the curve within it all, which is why they need to be Tuned to find out... Years ago I had my R-52 justa tuned at a RMW Tuning Event in town and some people thought I was crazy for paying $350 for the dyno tune on a Justa but while I only picked up 7 peak HP & Ft lbs I did have areas within the curve that picked up as much as 15 ft lbs... So that made it worth it to me...
Once a person well known in the automobile industry said "Best efforts will not substitute for knowledge." The meaning behind this was that just because somebody had done something for 30 years did not mean they had been doing the procedure correctly and that only advancement through knowledge would quality be improved. I had my car tuned by ByteTronik (BT). Whereas most dyno runs are performed in 4th gear ByteTronik does their WOT logging in 3rd gear. I did my base line dyno before I had the BT Full Access and it was done in 4th. When the tuning process was completed I had another dyno performed in 4th. The numbers were not where I thought they would be so when I got home I did a compression test. I had advised BT of the results and also provided them the logging data. The MINI ECU retards timing upon certain threshold IATs; at 137 it pulls 1.88 degrees, at 154 - 2.62, 171 - 4.5 and 190 -5.62. BT advised me that the ECU had enacted safety measures to protect the engine and thereby reduced the timing. During my dyno run the tech had the car idling for a good amount of time as the leads to the coil were giving him issues. During the pull the temperatures rose above 190 so timing was being pulled relative to HP but the max torque had been reached prior to 137. This run produced torque of 169 ft lbs. The results of the pressure test indicated that there might be a valve leakage issue so I pulled the head. I also reviewed my own head prep efforts at block sanding prior to placing the head gasket. The head did have valve leaks at #4 and also reflected heat blow-by due to a poor gasket seal. How much these two issues impacted total power I do not know but in my mind it is logical to assume that after the valves were corrected and I did the proper prep the engine would make more torque that in turn would produce more horsepower. I went to the speed shop but this time I fabricated a hood that I could attach over the intercooler. Via a dryer duct that was connected to my leaf blower I am able to provide a good flow over the intercooler. This extra ventilation made sure that even though the day was cooler than the ill fated bad head day, I would hopefully not exceed the 137 IAT threshold. All things went well and no IAT thresholds were exceeded. As BT does the WOT logging I told them I was going to do this run in 3rd gear. I heard nothing and the tech set the equipment up for a 3rd gear run. As the dyno does not measure horsepower but rather torque that it the converts to horsepower using time and some other factors the gear used should not create major issues with values ie an engine makes a certain torque at a given RPM. The pull was performed and the torque on the corrected head came in lower at 161, eight pounds less than when the head had leaking valves and a poor gasket seal. This did not make sense to me and I voiced my displeasure to BT. The answer that came back was that my boost was lower. This same boost issue was used days ago by the BT Tuner on a FB Car Page to an attempt to cast doubt on my assertions that they had detuned the car after the head was corrected. When BT first made the boost claim I told them that "boost" is a measure of resistance or back pressure and not a measure of power being produced as when an engine is ported or valve sizes increased the boost will go down with the same pulley ratio. After the BT Tuner again tried to use this lower boost value to discredit me I made a post that contained "The boost at 5218 on the bad head in 4th gear was 14.28 with 145 g/s or air mass. The boost at 5201 on the good head in 3rd gear was 12.99 with 149 g/s of air mass. Less boost but very similar g/s air mass yet the engine made 5% less torque." I am by no means a car tuner but I am also an individual that knows when I being bullshitted by someone.
And as far as why Mike Pinson does what he does, ask him. He is obviously a person that likes his MINI and is not afraid to experiment with it. He has blown up allot of engines, three of which were RMW produced units. As he tracks the car perhaps his assessments of the Thumper V0 was based upon his track times regardless I think it is utterly ridiculous to automatically discredit a product just because ThumperHeads sells it instead of RMW, both of which have Newman do the grinding. I would think you can tune for a cam but I find it interesting that BT tuned my car and never knew what the specs were on the TP 408 that I had installed. You would think that knowing the ICL, duration and the range of the duration would be important, but apparently not, at least to them.
That's the beauty of doing the dyno tune. Doesn't matter what mods you have done to it, your able to take those base readings and adjust from there... If you are doing/getting a "can" tune then yes the tuner needs to know what mods have been done to give you the correct "can" tune...
Agreed.. the cam spec isnt a needed data for a dyno tune ! run it , get base and then tune from there. This is how they do Dyno's since the late 60's , there are too many classified cams and manifolds in class racing, Drag or Track. And most track guys are not happy if a few HIGH HP cars show up in their class.. ( thus the invent of all the electronics back in the early 90's and the 9.90 Class @ the drags..) they will change the class requirements, or under tune the car. Thus the dyno befor the race. There are more than a few of my cars out there under tuned for just that reason... Dynos are a tool !!
I wish they would take the electronics out of all the class. Some of those "index classes" the cars leave the line for 1 second or so and then it's as if they turned off for another second or 2 then wide open again to the finish. I have a hard time enjoying watching that...
Here is a Primary tuned r53 with a TPR Top end kit ( TPR2r Head/TPR ported Intake V series camshaft ) and Sprintex
305.4 WHP @ 6300 rev / 279.6 Tq @ 5250 Rev. there is an issue at 900 ( idle ) to 1500 rev. LOL He was told to drive it an then come back for are re-tune to get rid of it!!
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