Ethanol free vs 10%

Discussion in 'MINI' started by THE ITCH, Sep 10, 2012.

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  1. Norm03s

    Norm03s New Member

    May 5, 2009
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    The UK has 95 octane with no stupid ethanol added but it ain't cheap.
    The whole scam of adding ethanol by mandate is screwing up the price of foodstuffs worldwide.
    Using ethanol actually creates more smog than using regular gas, and the EPA's own attorneys had to admit that fact in front of the justices presiding over the Third Circuit Court of Appeals in 1995 (API v. EPA).
     
  2. Denzien

    Denzien New Member

    Sep 12, 2012
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    Are you doing this for every tank?
     
  3. bmwr606

    bmwr606 New Member

    May 10, 2012
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    yes, most tanks ... every once in a while i get to low to make the trip and just fillup with E10

    i notice about 6mpg loss using the E10

    scott
     
  4. grodenglaive

    grodenglaive New Member

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    Hi Itch,
    The car is engineered to run on 91 octane. Unless you are running higher boost than stock, using 93 will not give any advantage. Also, since the stuff you are currently using is 10% ethanol, then you will be using (slightly) more fuel to get the same power you would get from 91 that's 100% gas. So unless the 93 with ethanol is cheaper than the pure 91, it is a waste of money.

    Fact or Fiction?: Premium Gasoline Delivers Premium Benefits to Your Car: Scientific American
    HowStuffWorks "What does octane mean?"
    MYTH BUSTING: High Octane fuel will make a car faster
     
  5. THE ITCH

    THE ITCH New Member

    Mar 3, 2011
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    grodenglaive
    Thanks for the good common sense analogy. This all makes good sense.
    In reading your last link here is a paragraph that I believe applies to our supercharged or turbocharged Mini's

    "What clouds the issue is some of the 'smarter' engine management systems used by car manufacturers today. As well as being able to measure when pre-ignition occurs and alter the ignition timing, boost (in turbocharged cars) and other factors to stop it, these engines can also 'tune' themselves up to take advantage of the extra octane rating and potentially make more power."

    Currently my GP has a custom tune (done with 93 octane 10% ethanol Sunoco fuel) with a basically stock engine. I am of the opinion that during times when heat becomes a factor, either by weather temperatures or prolonged high RPM use, the ECU will start to pull timing because it senses detonation. In the old days cars didn't have this ability but I believe they do now.
    Thanks, Steve



     
  6. Denzien

    Denzien New Member

    Sep 12, 2012
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    So I guess you've run the numbers and you're close to breaking even or even coming out ahead by putting an extra 42 miles on your car every time you fill up?

    I don't suppose the butt-dyno has any influence here either, eh? :cornut:
     
  7. bmwr606

    bmwr606 New Member

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  8. allgrainer

    allgrainer New Member

    Oct 3, 2012
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    I wonder how a tank of 110 racing fuel would alter performance. It's available here you just have to pump it in a container. They won't let you pull your vehicle up to the pump. It is unleaded. It use to be leaded a couple years ago.
     
  9. KittyMini

    KittyMini Club Coordinator

    Jun 24, 2009
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    Unless you are tuned to take advantage of it, it won't do anything for you.
     
  10. bmwr606

    bmwr606 New Member

    May 10, 2012
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    it may make you feel good

    it will certainly lighten your wallet

    without a tune/modifications it will do nothing for performance

    scott
     
  11. Nathan

    Nathan Founder

    Mar 30, 2009
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    1. It will make your wallet lighter.

    2. It makes the exhaust smell awesome.

    3. Turns the tips white instead of black.
     
  12. bmwr606

    bmwr606 New Member

    May 10, 2012
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    getting an extra 5-6 mpg using the E0 translates to an extra 60-72 miles per tank

    the engines starts smoother during cold starts

    ethanol is corrosive, the less exposure, the better

    i cannot say my butt dyno feels any advantage to the E0, but my wallet dyno says the extra cost of the E0 is negated by the extra gas mileage it yields

    the 42 mile r/t to get the E0 is all on backroads and is a very nice drive

    scott
     
  13. cct1

    cct1 Well-Known Member
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    May 5, 2009
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    Thanks for the links, my town is in there, Kwik trip from here on out for me...


    I hate ethanol on principle more than performance--I hate all the politics behind ethanol, especially the ethanol plants that were SUPPOSED to be co-ops for the farmers, but instead are owned by a few individuals who in turn have screwed the people who were supposed to be helped by it--it's not like that everywhere, but locally, that's exactly what happened. A bunch of people making money off it who shouldn't be.
     
  14. LowCountry S

    LowCountry S Active Member

    May 14, 2009
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    I used to run 101LL in my flathead ford for years; it's great having a friend who works at an airport.......

    I put 93 no ethanol in the MINI (04) at local station less than 2m from house regularly now; did the "re-learn the ecu to your driving" trick after I started using it and get more "oomph" (buttdyno) and better gas mileage


    and yes Nathan, you need corn for a proper chicken corn chowder..........turnips not so much
     
  15. amancuso

    amancuso New Member

    May 8, 2012
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    No such thing as Ethanol free here in NJ.

    * correction, there are 2 but both of them are too far to benefit from any cost saving.
     
  16. oldvet53

    oldvet53 New Member

    Oct 21, 2012
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    #36 oldvet53, Oct 27, 2012
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2012
    I don't have any local stations that don't have 10% Ethanol at the pumps, however there is a lot of stock car drivers being the home of Mark Martin and there is one place that sells leaded Racing fuel that is 106 or 112 octane but is around $5.00-$6.00 a gal! Back when I had my '70 429CJ Ranchero I ran a qt. of Moroso fuel additive to keep it from knocking as it was the last year of factory 11:1 compression ratio engines or would go to the local airport (small town) and get 110/145 Aviation fuel but don't know if the local airport will sell it to me here. I found one station here localy that sells 91 octane pure gas but it is in the $5.00 a gal. range. Out of my price range. Thanks for the link or I wouldn't have found that one station.
     
  17. Jason Montague

    Jason Montague New Member
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    :cornut: Me Too! They only sell 91 octane ethanol free gas around here. All 93 octane has the ethanol.:Thumbsup:

    Jason
     
  18. bmwr606

    bmwr606 New Member

    May 10, 2012
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    given those choices, i would run the 91E0 over the 93E10

    i get better mileage and a smoother running engine, most noticable at cold start, with the 91E0

    scott
     
  19. oldvet53

    oldvet53 New Member

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    I have found a local Conoco station next to the Sheriff Office that sells 93 octane without ethanol for $3.79 a gal and a .03c discount for cash a gal. So I'm going to start running it and see how much of a difference as far as performance.:Thumbsup:
     
  20. oldvet53

    oldvet53 New Member

    Oct 21, 2012
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    I used to run Sonoco 106 leaded Racing fuel half and half with 93 octane no lead Sunoco in my Triumph Cafe racer and I had a 4 gal. tank on it so 2 gal of 93 no lead and 2 gal 106 leaded racing fuel. My Triumph was built when leaded gas was the norm. and it needed it for the valves and guides, when I ran straight 93 no lead the plugs would run black all the time even though it ran pretty hot. But when I mixed the 2 fuels within 15-20 miles and I'd do a plug check and the plugs would look almost like I had just taken them out of the box with just a light brown tinge to the plugs and ran like a scalded dog and the pipes would turn chalky white! So the better fuel you can run the better your vehicle will run but don't run leaded with a cat as it will destroy it.:thumbs up:
     

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