F1 - 2012

Discussion in 'Motorsports Chat & Race Preparation' started by Nathan, Sep 1, 2011.

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  1. Nathan

    Nathan Founder

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    We've had the gravel traps and if you go off the wrong way you are going ass over teacups, hence the move to replace gravel with the newer paved areas.

    The Physics of Gravel Traps in F1
     
  2. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    Making the tracks safer is the right thing to do. Gravel traps while better than some earlier solutions can cause things to go wrong in a very bad way. They work, but are not the right solution in every instance. Remember when catch fencing was considered the ultimate in trackside protection? :frown2:
     
  3. Zapski

    Zapski Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps so, I bring it up due to this quote:

    Source
     
  4. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    I agree with that. As long as they punish the rules breakers even the dumbest one will figure it out pretty darned quick. Better that than having the trackside more dangerous to discourage such moves. As safe as this sport is these days it is still hella dangerous.

    Back in the old days foolish moves were often paid for with drivers lives. I like things much better now.

    Going back to Valencia Lewis threw away a bagful of points in a pissing match with Maldonado. Yes it was Maldonato's fault, but what was Lewis thinking?
     
  5. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    There's no need to go back to dangerous track layouts to keep people from doing unsportsmanlike things like using the safe run-off areas to gain competitive advantage. Those run-off areas aren't exactly brand new but new ways to abuse them are found occasionally. When this happens, a new rule is written or an existing rule modified; this particular rule is very simple to understand and there's no gray area. As long as those who break it are held accountable with punishment that fits the "crime," so to speak, I say all good.

    In this case I don't know whether the gain of competitive advantage is technically the issue like it is when you cut a chicane, it may not even be mentioned in this particular rule. He drove with all four wheels outside the track line, that's the rule broken here. It happens plenty with no penalty applied but it looks like the reason it was enforced this time is because he gained a competitive advantage in the process -- he passed Button -- so the stewards decided to enforce the rule.

    Vettel knows the rule and he knew full well at the time that he was completely off the track. That means, though he doesn't want to admit it, he knew at the time that he'd broken the rule and he obviously also knew that he'd passed someone as a result. I don't know whether he would have been OK if he'd given the position back to Button (like you have to do if you gain by cutting a chicane, sounds right but might not be the same sort of rule).

    If Button had passed him that way I'd bet money that Vettel would have been screaming over his team radio to have Button reported to the stewards.
     
  6. minimark

    minimark Well-Known Member

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    #606 minimark, Jul 23, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2012
    ^Exactly.

    ...and if rolls were reversed, Button would be crying that he didn't do anything wrong. The rules worked, they were broken, penalty assessed, no need to change a thing, move on to the next race.

    Race on Chaps!!:cool:
     
  7. goaljnky

    goaljnky New Member

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    I'm curious why Vettle did not give the position back to at least have one more shot at a clean pass. Ain't hind site great?
     
  8. Crashton

    Crashton Club Coordinator

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    Me thinks it is not in a drivers nature to give back a spot they worked all race long to get. All Vettel was thinking is finally got him. Once his team told him that Jenson was yelling to the FIA it was too late to give the place back. At least that is my take.

    On to the Hungarian GP!
     
  9. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    Sorry for the apparent re-post but this is the HQ version.

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVGXoFO1znM]McLAREN - TOONED Episode 2 SLICKS (HD) - YouTube[/ame]
     
  10. Zapski

    Zapski Well-Known Member

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    I love those animated shorts :)

    If you want to see the real life inside of McLaren, along with the actual drivers, there's this.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOHQKCILqdM[/ame]
     
  11. ScottinBend

    ScottinBend Space Cowboy
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    Here is the latest on the Red Bull engine mapping debacle.....

    Rules clarification confirms change to RBR engine mapping - Racer.com

    Not sure why it is a problem. Why wouldn't a team be allowed to adjust the engine mapping? I know they have to use a "standard" ECU, but I would have thought they could then be able to tweak it as needed. I mean this is F1 right, the supposed pinnacle of racing?
     
  12. Alan

    Alan Active Member

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    FIA went to the standard ECU in F1 to get rid of Traction Control and Launch Control. Thus the linear throttle position to torque requirement.
     
  13. ScottinBend

    ScottinBend Space Cowboy
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    I knew that, but it just seems so ridiculous that they wouldn't allow the teams the same tweaks that we can enjoy with our own cars. It's not like they can duplicate traction control simply with the torque mapping, it would be close but it would be the same map for the entire race w/o any way to turn it off.
     
  14. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    Apparently there's more to this engine mapping thing than the mid-range torque issue. According to this article over at PitPass.com, Red Bull figured out a way to reintroduce exhaust blowing, the big technical issue that was at the center of most of the controversy last year and outlawed starting this season.

    I agree that in the end it means even greater restriction and it pushes F1 even closer to a controlled, spec series. That bugs me too, but in the end it turns out to be the way they chose to plug a loophole Red Bull found in the anti-blown exhaust regulation.
     
  15. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    There are some interesting pics here from Hockenheim. I would just link them here but the photographer's descriptions (Mark Sutton) are worth the jump.

    Here are a couple examples though:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  16. Zapski

    Zapski Well-Known Member

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    Part of me say's let them. Isn't pushing the rules and finding the boundaries part of the game? If Red Bull's found an edge, then the other teams need to step up their games. As long as they aren't in direct violation of something then maybe it should slide until next season.

    Besides, it's not like they're chewing up the pavement this year like they did last year. Whatever advantage they've found isn't helping them win races consistently.
     
  17. ScottinBend

    ScottinBend Space Cowboy
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    Hadn't heard that. If that is the case then Red Bull knew they were doing something to skirt the reg's, regardless of what the actual wording was.
     
  18. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    Here's Vettel both seemingly confirming the blown exhaust side of the story and putting on a brave face about the effects of changes they now have to make.

    Vettel downplays impact of FIA ruling regarding Red Bull's engine mapping (AutoSport.com)
     
  19. Steve

    Steve Administrator
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    #619 Steve, Jul 26, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2012
    Here's an interesting overview of what goes down within an F1 team behind the media front. The author, a McLaren insider at the time, takes a whack at explaining (at the macro level) what happened at McLaren in that famous (infamous?) 2007 season...do Spygate and the Alonso vs. Hamilton battle sound familiar?

    It's long...I'll only past a few snips here, if you want the rest, click the title.

    On the front line: The invisible divide (TheF1Times.com)
     
  20. Nathan

    Nathan Founder

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    Love that insider stuff, it make it more interesting to watch the race and see the team orders unfold.
     

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