Vettel didn't pass under yellow. The yellow light was for slippery track. Any one that says he isn't a great driver didn't watch this race and the one two races ago. Not to mention his first win in the rain in a TR. Yes, Alonso probably deserves the championship more. But stop whining. It's like the Schumacher days again. Go back and watch the racing in the 70s, 80s, and 90s. Then tell me about tactics and dirty driving.
Take it easy. No one is whining. Just having a friendly discussion about some amazing drivers who produced and amazing season with an amazing finale.
As to the pass under yellow......he did, but still no clear answer as to what the SOLID yellow lights mean.
No one is saying Vettel isn't a great driver, just that Alonso had to extract more from what he had to drive than Seb did to get the finishes...that is all. No one is whining, just applauding Alonso for his personal effort. Both are very good drivers indeed!!
Me thinks it is the same as a standing yellow, NO passing. Slippery or debris is yellow with diagonal red stripes. No worries about Seb winning the championship. Bernie was not going to let anything happen to his young money maker. :wink: I'm not whining my supercharger is. :cornut:
Sorry about the whining comment. I agree Alonzo did an outstanding job. The stewards said the light was for slick track not a yellow flag.
Everybody talks about the Ferrari not being easy to drive, but neither was the Red Bull, when they lost their rear diffuser design it made the car extemely difficult to balance, Seb said so himself. The car didn't drive anything like last year's car and he had to learn how to make it work - just like Alonso. I say it was a terrific season of close racing with a multitude of drivers winning, thats what makes a fun season to watch and despite all Bernie's machinizations it really worked well. I'm looking forward to next season, except for the NBC and Leigh Diffey part. Either I'll be watching without the sound or I'll have to find an alternate site to watch from.
I can't find anything anywhere that shows what a standing yellow light means as opposed to a flashing one.
My impression was that a flashing yellow was a full course caution whilst a constant yellow was for a local caution...either way you could not pass there...
Apparently there is talk that a solid yellow on the light boards is the same as a yellow/red flag. If it were a caution then the light would have been flashing yellow. The caution indicator lights on vettel's wheel confirm this. When there is a caution on the course, the drivers get an indication on the left side of the steering wheel. According to the official FIA rules, the use of lights is covered under supplementary rules that are on a per race basis, so we will likely never know exactly how those read.
My experience is with SCCA racing & track days. FIA may have different rules for F1. :confused5: Whatever it was it must have been OK. Seb was not penalized.
My experience is with SCCA and NASA, and like you, I find this use of lights pretty confusing. I am used to a yellow anything, waving, standing etc., meaning there is a caution on the course and you are not allowed to pass.
I have a feeling this video won't stay up long before it's pulled, but here's a bit of detailed analysis of a few F1 flag rules and a few of Vettel's passes and the flag conditions at the time. It's long-ish and excruciatingly slow, esp at the start, but hang in there. FWIW, I'm not judging or pointing fingers or whatever, the race is run and the title is decided, just trying to help move the discussion past the controversy. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFER0esusF0]Vettel Yellow Flag Passes at Brazilian GP 2012 - YouTube[/ame]
Internationally, there is no such thing as a 'full course caution' (there is a safety car caution with SC signs but that is a bit different). A single waved yellow flag is a caution and I think the solid yellow light (sorry, lights are still new to us...) means the same - hazard on track, be prepared to slow down. Double waved yellow flags or a flashing yellow light is a severe caution - meaning slow down for sure, and be prepared to stop if necessary, track workers may be on track. Normally the red and yellow flag is shown on its own. So what the marshals were doing with both the yellow and red/yellow flags, I've no idea - and possibly the drivers didn't either. And there is no pink flag, which when waved does not mean "Hello, sailor...".
Understand it is called a safety car caution in F1, but what are the lights doing when the safety car is out, are they not flashing yellow?
Thanks Steve, bet that video does not stay up long. Uncle Bernie made sure his boy was OK.:wink: I can understand how this can happen in the heat of competition. Easy to not see anything other than the cars on the track you are overtaking.
Very true. Plus, as some of the commenters on that video have said, there may have been a marshall waving a green flag on the left well before they got to that flashing green light and before the pass. The video isn't good enough to be sure but it may be true. If so, that last pass would have been legal despite the yellow lights on Vettel's wheel. But I really only posted that video to help understand the pass on Kobayashi. :smile5:
I'd have to say those trackside lights & the ones on the wheel would trump a marshals flag. You'd figure F1 would have this stuff figured out. Heck winning the world championship & there is a question of a deserved penalty not being handed out. Guess we should put this one to bed, because this can go on forever. :wink:
That video was the best explanation of the lights on the drivers wheel in combination with the flags that I have seen yet.