F1 Most liked posts in thread: F1 - 2013

mrntd · Dec 31, 2012

Bernie did a good job of pulling together a mess and making it the sport it is. But he has gone off the edge and needs to go.

If Montezemolo gets the call it would be the business side of F1 not the rules side. So he wouldn't be make the rules. This has been one of the problems with Bernie, He this he can make the rules. Montezemolo has proven to be a very good businessman. (Yes I like Ferrari but I am a Red Bull fan).

The next guy needs to run the business side professionally and make money for CVC. Extorting tracks and promoters, stiffing teams or playing favoritism isn't professional. Also throwing out crazy ideas just to get a reaction or your face in the press isn't in the sports best interest.

I think it would be in CVC's best interest to include an advisory board from the teams like the working groups for the rules. F1 is a big business for the teams also so getting input on the business side should be a win for both sides.

Zapski · Dec 31, 2012

Being a fairly recent F1 fan, I can't say that I know much about all the permutations and politics that have ever happened. I've been reading about past seasons, watching videos, trying to get better informed and so on, but the mountain of minutia and information out there is pretty daunting.

That said (and thus trying to excuse the potential ignorance of anything I might say here) I wonder what the sport would be like if Jackie Stewart took Bernie's place?

He's a legendary driver, former team owner, and vocal advocate for the sport. Just dreaming here....

Minidave · Dec 31, 2012

It may be heresy to say so, but I think they need someone younger to take over......

I hear Danny Bahar is available.....:arf:

Steve · Dec 31, 2012

Yeah, I'd like to know what F1 would be like if Jackie Stewart had taken over 10 years ago. I understand he has a bit of a head for business so he might have done well. He is nearly 10 years younger than Bernie though so I'd still vote for that change right now. Someone younger? I think Paul Stoddart, the guy who used to run Minardi, would make a great choice.

minimark · Dec 31, 2012

Big fan of Mr Stewart and think he has single handedly saved more race car drivers lives than any other human being and at one time would have enthusiastically supported him as the chief of F1. That said, he is now much older, his ego much larger and the chances of that roll going to his head much greater. Jackie would now be a dictator, his way and only his way would be the rule of the day, very little if any consideration to any other ideas would be given....and who does that sound like?

Another vote for a bit younger and fresher person.

Nathan · Dec 31, 2012

Ya'll should read The Piranha Club.

The Piranha Club: Power and Influence in Formula One: Timothy Collins: 9780753509654: Amazon.com: Books

The Piranha Club is the first serious study of Formula One's most intriguing and influential figures – the men who wield the real power. It is an entertaining and incisive analysis of the Formula One paddock, explaining how it works, who runs it, how it makes money and what sort of people exist there.

I'd be happy to send my copy to anyone that wants to read it.

minirab · Dec 31, 2012

Read the book within this past year, what goes on on the other side of

the camera is enlightening to say the least. That book should be re-

quired reading for anyone who has an interest in F1 either past or present.

minimark · Dec 31, 2012

Nathan I thank you for the recommendation and will accept your offer. Be glad to send it right back to you or on to the next person!!

Steve · Jan 1, 2013

Brawn: Aero changes caused slump (AutoSport.com)

Ross Brawn believes that mid-season changes in Mercedes' Formula 1 aerodynamic department were the root cause of the team's slump in form during the second half of 2012.

Mercedes, which took over the world champion Brawn squad in late 2009, scored its first F1 race win as a constructor since 1955 when Nico Rosberg dominated the Chinese Grand Prix from pole position.

By the halfway point of 2012, Rosberg lay sixth in the championshp, only 34 points behind Red Bull's Sebastian Vettel.

But the squad's form suffered during the second half of the year, Rosberg eventually trailing world champion Vettel by 189 points and Michael Schumacher's sixth place in Brazil its only points finish from the final six grands prix.

Team principal Brawn said that the departure of head of aerodynamics Loic Bigois, coupled with a change in windtunnel philosophy while the team experimented with Coanda exhausts and double DRS, also played a major influence.

Brawn said: "We made a decision to change the structure of the aero group. We had to wait for [new aero chief] Mike Elliot to join us because we had a notice period he had to fulfil at Lotus.

"We concluded the situation with Loic and there was a gap that we didn't fill very well."

"On top of that we were doing the transition from 50 per cent to 60 per cent models in the windtunnel, and there were a lot of other things in the aero group as well. It did have an impact."

Brawn said that the shift to 60 per cent models was necessary to increase the amount of technical data it could extract from Pirelli's tyres.

"Our conclusion was that we would get a much more representative tyre at 60 per cent than at 50 per cent," he added.

"Pirelli have to make 50 per cent and 60 per cent windtunnel tyres. There are only two teams that are still doing 50 per cent.

"Even with Pirelli's best efforts, they're going to be getting better feedback about 60 per cent tyres than 50 per cent. So we wanted to make the move.

"The other thing that has happened over the years is that you're putting more and more equipment inside the windtunnel model to measure, monitor and check. We just ran out of space in the 50 per cent model.

"There were things that we wanted to do that we couldn't do, and we needed the 60 per cent model to accommodate those features. Sixty per cent is the legal limit you can go to, there is no further step we can make."
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minimark · Jan 2, 2013

Steve said: ↑

Brawn: Aero changes caused slump (AutoSport.com)
Click to expand...

In short: "We dropped the ball."

Steve · Jan 2, 2013

Nathan said: ↑

Ya'll should read The Piranha Club.
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I probably should dust off my copy and actually read it.

Steve · Jan 2, 2013

Summary: Changes for the 2013 season (GPUpdate.net)

2 January 2013

A wide range of minor but potentially decisive regulation tweaks have been made ahead of the 2013 season, with governing body the FIA moving to tidy up the rulebook. GPUpdate.net takes a look at the main technical and driver changes.

Technical

Front wing tests: Following the continual debate between teams over flexible front wings, the FIA has outlined 'more stringent' load tests for the 2013 campaign.

Minimum weight: Previously capped at 640kg, the minimum weight of cars has now been raised to 642kg. This is to compensate the heavier Pirelli tyres in 2013.

Stepped noses: With widespread dissatisfaction expressed at the introduction of 'stepped noses' in 2012, a compromise has been reached between teams and the FIA for the upcoming season. The area in question can now feature a small laminate panel, aimed at improving the transition of the drop.

Force Majeure: The force majeure regulation, relating to a car stopping on-track in qualifying, has been dropped from the rulebook. In 2013, the FIA will judge the level of fuel a driver would have required to return to the pit lane and add it to the one-litre minimum sample required for testing after qualifying.

DRS use: For safety reasons, the Drag Reduction System (DRS) will only be permitted in the designated race zones throughout an entire Grand Prix weekend this season. Previously, the device could be freely activated in practice and qualifying.

Curfews: The personnel curfew, which limited the time team members were permitted to work on Thursday nights, has been extended from six to eight hours in 2013. However, the number of exceptions has been cut back from four to just two.

Teams and drivers

HRT failed to find a new owner after being put up for sale by Thesan Capital during the final stages of the 2012 campaign, forcing it to close its factory doors before the year was out. The 2013 grid features 11 teams, meaning the Q1 and Q2 qualifying sessions will see six drivers eliminated as opposed to the previous number of seven.

While there are no changes at Red Bull (Sebastian Vettel and Mark Webber), Ferrari (Fernando Alonso and Felipe Massa) or Lotus (Kimi RÃ¤ikkÃ¶nen and Romain Grosjean), Michael Schumacher's second retirement paved the way for a series of significant driver changes. Lewis Hamilton joins Nico Rosberg at Mercedes, while Mexico's Sergio PÃ©rez fills the vacant McLaren seat alongside Jenson Button.

New on the grid for 2013 is Esteban GutiÃ©rrez, the GP2 graduate partnering Nico HÃ¼lkenberg at Sauber. Williams has retained race winner Pastor Maldonado and promoted 2012 reserve Valtteri Bottas to a full-time seat, with Toro Rosso opting to field an unchanged pairing of Daniel Ricciardo and Jean-Ã‰ric Vergne. Max Chilton becomes the fourth British driver with his deal to race at Marussia next to Timo Glock.

There are still two seats available for the 2013 campaign, but the candidates have now been reduced to a very small number. Caterham has confirmed Charles Pic, with his team-mate expected to be either Vitaly Petrov or Giedo van der Garde. Force India, almost certain to confirm Paul di Resta, is yet to finalise its complete line-up. 2012 reserve Jules Bianchi and former driver Adrian Sutil are the remaining contenders.

Tyres

Pirelli outlined its tyre plans for the 2013 season to GPUpdate.net last month, with the Italian company eager to bring back higher degradation levels. The heavier rubber is expected to heat up and wear out at a faster rate, with the differences between compounds also set to be larger. Tyre strategies will be even more important as a result, but the changes will not be fully understood until pre-season testing begins.
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Steve · Jan 4, 2013

Smoke screen?

'RB9 has been compromised' - Newey (GPUpdate.net)

4 January 2013

Adrian Newey has admitted that the timescales surrounding the completion of Red Bull's new RB9 chassis have been compromised as a result of the 2012 title run-in, with Sebastian Vettel fighting for his third world title until the final race in Brazil.

Although explaining that a continual development push was the only logical choice for the team as the season drew to a close, Chief Technical Officer Newey is aware of the consequences and believes the team's 2013 preparations have taken a hit.

"We were introducing developments to the car right up to the penultimate race," Newey explained to Autosport. "That has made it difficult to introduce all of those and simultaneously develop the next car.

"This has compromised the timescales of the new car more than we would have liked. It was the right trade at the time because we managed to get the job done, but it means a busy winter trying to catch up."

Red Bull has not yet confirmed a launch date for its new challenger and is expected to make a decision over its ability to attend the opening pre-season test next week.
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Steve · Jan 7, 2013

My favorite line: "Keep him under control? Not even in my dreams. ..... I want drivers, not robots."

Lotus atmosphere helped Raikkonen shine, according to Gerard Lopez (AutoSport.com)

Monday, January 7th 2013, 14:35 GMT

Lotus owner Gerard Lopez believes Kimi Raikkonen managed to deliver so much for the team last year because it gave him the atmosphere he needed to thrive.

Lopez is convinced that Raikkonen dug deep to get the best out of himself, even though from the outside it was not always obvious.

"Everyone who had muttered that he wasn't motivated now comes around to tell me they knew Kimi was still super strong," said Lopez in an interview with Gazzetta dello Sport.

"It amuses me. I knew it would have ended up this way. Raikkonen has added hard work to his talent, and the results are the fruits of this cocktail."

When asked if Raikkonen was doing so well simply because of the freedom Lotus had given him, Lopez said: "It's not just the freedom. Raikkonen in Lotus feels utilised for what's most important, while he is free for everything else. He has found balance.

"Keep him under control? Not even in my dreams. I talk to him every week and he feels good, he is enthusiastic and charged up. I want drivers, not robots."

Lopez has also expressed his full support for Romain Grosjean, whom he reckons was unfairly criticised at times because of his involvement in a number of early race accidents.

"Romain didn't do all the mess he's been accused of," he said. "They [the critics] exaggerated on his account: in 2012 there were four drivers who were reprimanded more often than he was, however they were able to take part in every race.

"Grosjean instead was banned for the Italian GP. He paid for many others. But he has always shown he is quick. I expect a lot of him this year."

Translation by Michele Lostia
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minimark · Jan 7, 2013

Minidave said: ↑

Or, just send it along to me when you're done and I'll pass it back to Nathan....

speaking of book loans, Nathan do you know where my copy of Side Glances is these days? Don't need it back in any hurry, just want to be sure it doesn't get lost, that's all..
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Just received the book from Nathan (thank you sir!) Minidave so pm me your address and I will send it along shortly!!

Steve · Jan 7, 2013

Analysis: F1 teams facing dilemma over passive double DRS in 2013 (AutoSport.com)

By Jonathan Noble | Monday, January 7th 2013, 12:33 GMT

Formula 1 teams are facing an increasingly tough call on whether or not to pursue passive double DRS in 2013, despite rules tweaks that should theoretically boost its advantage.

The FIA has changed the DRS regulations for this year, with drivers now only allowed to activate the device in practice and qualifying at the areas of the track where it will be used in the race.

Trick 'double DRS' like those used by Mercedes and Red Bull - which fed air through ducts in the rear wing to help stall the aerodynamics for a straightline speed-boost - have also been outlawed.

However, passive DRS concepts as tested by Mercedes and Lotus last year, which can stall the wing for a speed boost on all straights, remain legal, and should produce a bigger advantage because of the rules tweak that restrict normal DRS usage.

Click here to read about how the passive DRS systems work

The implementation of the passive double DRS remains far from a no-brainer however, especially after both Mercedes and Lotus encountered difficulties in gaining confidence with the systems last year.

The biggest problem was in getting the device to switch on and switch off at the correct speed.

The device has to trigger at a speed that is higher than the fastest corner, so drivers do not encounter a sudden loss of downforce in the high-speed turns where they need it the most.

This means that the benefit from the passive systems is limited only to those sections of straights that are faster than the quickest corners, so it is not as much value at venues with a lot of quick turns.

The ideal stomping ground for passive DRS is tracks that feature long straights and only low speed corners.

There is also a further complication in that Lotus and Mercedes both found that due to air pressure characteristics surrounding an F1 car, the speed at which the passive DRS switched off to re-engage the rear wing was not always the same as that where it switched on.

This meant that the trigger point had to be adjusted even higher to ensure that there was no risk of drivers not having rear downforce for corners immediately after long straights.

Speaking about the concept at the end of last year, Brawn said that if the passive DRS got the go-ahead then it would be unlikely to feature on the car at every race.

"Where it engages and where it re-engages are often not necessarily the same speed - as it can have some lag," he said, when asked by AUTOSPORT about the difficulties Mercedes had encountered.

"For some tracks it will not be worth it, you won't be able to get any substantial advantage out of it.

"You need tracks with a good series of low-speed corners, as soon as you get high-speed corners you can't afford for it to be operating and the threshold becomes very high and the advantage is very small."

Ahead of a season where it is expected that the F1 field will closer further up because of rules stability, any advantage is still keenly pursued though, which is why passive double DRS remains attractive.

Brawn added: "The advantage of that is that you can use it all the time. I don't think it will make a huge difference in qualifying when you can use the normal DRS, but with passive systems they are every lap.

"At the moment you can only use DRS when you are close to a car in front, but with passive systems you can use them all the time, which is why they are attractive."

Mercedes and Lotus headed into the winter determined to keep evaluating the passive double DRS concept, and AUTOSPORT understands that both teams are still considering the idea as they close in on completing their 2013 cars.

It is also likely that rival teams have put work in to trying to get the systems working.

However, Brawn was convinced that even if teams do get the passive DRS working properly in 2013 then it will not be a golden ticket for success.

"The performance gain is there, but it is not huge," he said. "It's not like F-duct was. It is something that is nice to have, but it is not going to be a game changer in terms of your competitiveness."
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Zapski · Jan 7, 2013

So the passive system is one that engages when the air-pressure reaches a critical point, then a wing flips open?

It makes me wonder if there's a way to make the turbulence of one wing stall another at a certain airspeed... or is that what they're talking about?

Steve · Jan 7, 2013

I haven't seen a great explanation yet of the sort of system they're talking about here. No one who cares to speculate can actually see what's going on inside these things and no one who actually knows how they work will divulge their secret(s).

It's apparently not about a wing flipping or otherwise opening though, I think that would make it illegal. Part of one pretty good attempt at explanation I found on the Interwebs:

"There are two aero effects being used with this device, the method to â€˜switchâ€™ the blown effect on above certain speeds and the effect to stall the rear wing. The â€˜Switchâ€™ effect, as previously described is passive, with no moving parts or external interaction."

Here's the full write-up:
Lotus: DRS Device Analysis | ScarbsF1.com

Here's another:
SomersF1: Lotus E20 Passive F-Duct System (DDRS/Super DRS) â€“ Part 2

Zapski · Jan 8, 2013

Steve said: ↑

I haven't seen a great explanation yet of the sort of system they're talking about here. No one who cares to speculate can actually see what's going on inside these things and no one who actually knows how they work will divulge their secret(s).

It's apparently not about a wing flipping or otherwise opening though, I think that would make it illegal. Part of one pretty good attempt at explanation I found on the Interwebs:

"There are two aero effects being used with this device, the method to â€˜switchâ€™ the blown effect on above certain speeds and the effect to stall the rear wing. The â€˜Switchâ€™ effect, as previously described is passive, with no moving parts or external interaction."

Here's the full write-up:
Lotus: DRS Device Analysis | ScarbsF1.com

Here's another:
SomersF1: Lotus E20 Passive F-Duct System (DDRS/Super DRS) â€“ Part 2
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Fascinating! Thanks!

Steve · Jan 11, 2013

Looks like we won't be cringing at the sound of the 2014 engines.

AUTOSPORT's verdict on 2014 Formula 1 engines (AutoSport.com)

By Jonathan Noble | Friday, January 11th 2013, 14:48 GMT

AUTOSPORT Group F1 Editor Jonathan Noble's verdict on the 2014 engines

People normally say you should believe nothing of what you hear and only half of what you see.

But today was an exception to that rule - as selected Formula 1 media, including AUTOSPORT, got a first chance to listen to exactly what a 2014 V6 turbo engine is going to sound like.

For years we have heard conflicting stories about the audio qualities (or lack of them) of the new 2014 V6 turbo engines.

In one corner were Bernie Ecclestone and a few race promoters - who suggested they would sound 'terrible' and needed to be dropped.

In the other corner were the engine manufacturers who insisted the power units would deliver a different - but still satisfying â€“ noise.

At Brixworth today, Mercedes-Benz delivered its definitive answer to the debate when it played the audio from a dyno simulated lap of the Monza track.

And the smiles around the table of those hearing it for the first time delivered a conclusive answer that fans will have little to worry about.

Yes, the high-pitched shriek of the V8 engines hitting the rev limiter at 18,000rpm may be gone, but the new deeper noise is certainly nothing to be disappointed about.

There is still a solidness to the sound; one that will be amplified when the engines are put onto racing cars with proper exhausts and allowed to play flat-chat on race tracks around the world.

Mercedes' engine chief Andy Cowell reckons the new engines actually sound 'sweeter' than the current V8s, and no one present today could disagree.

The state of secrecy in F1 means that audio of the engines will not be ready for public consumption for a while â€“ for even the sound could provide an advantage to rivals â€“ but fans should rest assured that there is little to fear from what is coming in 2014.

You will still need your ear plugs next year. And that is great news.
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