I'm not saying the stock IC is bad, but it's not the best either when compared to the likes of a GP unit. As stated before, not everyone is able or even willing to shell out the money for a GP IC but for those looking for something in-between, this maybe a good choice. And I also don't think dismissing other options without trying them first is doing us any favors either. I called around to a couple shops to see about having the 2 units flow tested, but at this point, I don't think spending the $150 to do it is worth the effort. If no one is willing to be open minded enough to admit that there might be a better option than stock then any results I get will be disputed or dismissed as an anomaly. I've had this unit on my car for about a month and it's proven to me to be a step up from my stock unit. I drove over 300 miles with it this weekend and it never seemed to lack for power even in 95 degree temps. I was able to easily overtake other cars on the highway and two lane back roads without having to downshift from 6th gear, which I did have to do with the stock IC in hot weather. One of the things Eric mentioned in his thread about the Helix FMIC is how it always pulled hard and didn't show any signs of suffering from heat soak. This intercooler's performance has been the same for me all weekend.
In your first post, the IAT's were no better than stock. So if you are running it hard, when is it recovering? You've also thrown out there you have more Torque/boost with the Forge. This is the first time in recorded R53 history that this has actually happened (although it's been claimed many times). I don't think even the DOS guys made that claim; it's all been about maintaining what you have with cool temps rather than increasing power. No offense, but I'm skeptical, placebo effects are strong, especially on a large mod. I'd have to see proof of this on a dyno--Forge versus OEM, same day, same conditions.
Okay, we are looking to get the highest air density possible right? So if you can keep the air temperature the same but increase the amount of air, you still achieve a higher air density which equals to more power. This is where I think the majority of us get caught up. We only seem to focus on if it cools better than the stock IC and not if it flows better. Honestly, I would love to see this tested on a dyno as well, but it's not something that's going to happen until I get a tune done on the car.
Like Sprintex syndrome... It is expensive, sounds cool, and the boost gauge says you are getting more boost, so that is interpreted by your wallet-minded brain as you are getting your moneys worth of power. In actuality with a Sprintex, all of that money is giving you a cool sound, and more boost, but more heat than can be dealt with by even the casing of the blower, the seals, and everything on the outlet side of the blower... In all actuality, there is no power gain due to the shortfalls and buildup of heat but your mind hears that new whine, and sees the needle of the boost gauge going further up so you think it is faster. Sure you might rip one good pull when you first strap it to a dyno, and yes it might show it is better than stock for that run before the truth comes out as it heats up. Moving away from Sprintex Syndrome, you are bringing up a part that has been around a LONG time. Its been tried and tested by hundreds of MINI owners, and been shown time and time again to not even offer any performance gain over the stock I/C by the honest modders. Sure, in your mind you are seeing that boost needle, and the temp gauge do their thing, and your mind is trying to justify your purchase, but until you strap the car to a dyno and run it against the stock I/C back to back as fast as you can pull the 12 bolts and swap them out you will never know for sure. Or you can take the advise and experience of others for what they are worth. Hundreds of people with the same conclusion against one with the opposite doesn't mean that the hundreds are wrong, or that you are right.
That's where I think many of us are skeptical. For the stock IC, most of us believe it's optimized for flow, or pretty damned close, there isn't much you can do about it with such a confined space, and you're still limited by the intercooler horns; many have tried different configurations, none have made more power. The function of the IC isn't increasing flow, it's passive--it's cooling. The supercharger is pushing the air, and there's only so much air it can push (especially compared to a turbo), if you have too much diameter in the tube, and the forced induction isn't pushing more air, pressure drops and you lose boost, and power, even if it's cooler air. I get the part about cooler air being more dense, that's where cooling helps you. But I have a hard time believing the Forge somehow has come across some previously unknown diameter or flow pattern that magically increases boost over the stock IC. You're giving the IC credit for doing more than it actually does.
Until your cheapie meth system controller craps out again... At least it wasn't tuned for meth... Time for an HSF-2.
And I understand the skepticism, but how many IC out there are the same height as the Forge? This design has been out since 2005 but I think most people are turned away from it because of how it sits in the scoop. I've seen plenty of IC comparison threads, but only one with the Forge IC. I'm sure Clint had the same scepticism when he started the development the DOS A2A IC, but he did in fact make an improvement over stock, even better than the GP. As far as the IC horns go, you're right, and that was the point I was making earlier. I don't think the factory IC is optimally sized for the amount of air that the SC is pushing with anything other than a stock pulley. All of the other designs stick with the same core height and forces the air to go around the width of the IC. This one is taller so it has a more direct flow of air through the core with less restriction.
The DOS guys never claimed they made more power. They did claim, and rightly so, they had the data to back it up, that they maintained power to a much better degree than stock. Only way to solve it is to dyno it for an extended period. Virtually every other IC has failed this test. You give theoreticals why it MIGHT be better, but those same theoreticals MIGHT just make it worse. Forge, to my knowledge, has never shown any data, unlike DOS. Until it's out there, all we have is to take your word for it. I'm not trying to be nasty, but we've been down this road before too many times with IC's and other products, and it will take hard data before anyone is going to bite. My guess is it's no better than stock, might be worse. None of us have the definitive proof one way or the other. And when that's the case, most of us will take a pass.
Yes, I know, it helps keep the power you already make... And if I had the resources they had, then I would provide data either for or against, but I'm presenting my findings in the best way I can by monitoring temperature and pressure over a period of time.
Unless you have the exact same data (ambient temp, humidity, operating temp, everything else) for the stock I/C too, it really does minimal good.
True, and that's why I wanted to wait till the temperature warmed up so it would be closer to the summer time conditions that I ran my stock IC in all of last year. Still not optimal I know, but better than comparing 95+ degree temps and low humidity against ~70 degree temps and high humidity.