One more data point. I spoke with Madness recently about a few suspension parts including their lower control arms bushings. They are indeed very similar to the PowerFlex bushings. However they did say that they used a softer durometer polyurethane in their bushings and they are made in the USA. He also said that they stopped production of their lower control arms b/c the parts didn't meet their definition of streetable b/c of the noise they generate and increased wear (especially in poor weather environs) - much like the PSRS system. I doubt either of these options would be sales leaders and probably not worth the continued development and stocking costs. Would be nice to have a better solution overall. I'd love to try some poly bushes on the LCA but I don't want to deal with possible noise issues on my DD Mini. I'm running Powerflex on the LCA of my FD Rx7 and they are great for aggressive driving and track days but they do squeak after a while. I live in CA so I have good weather and the bushes have been on 2 years and less than 10k miles.
Sorry but we can't price match. By Alta putting such big discounts on parts they are putting their dealers out of the Alta part business. They are selling their parts way cheaper than what our "dealer" price is. Not a good deal as a alta dealer.
That's pretty crappy, I can understand a company wanting to liquidate its supply of a discontinued product line but this sounds like Alta is just undercutting the retailers and waiting for more of this product to be produced at the same time.
From reading the "other" board, it seems that this sale has caused quite a bit of a stir, mostly because they did not stock up for their big sale and they increased some prices to "MSRP" after they began the sale. Alta seems to be going through a rough patch no? From boost pipes that eventually get torn from improper design, to their version 2 pulleys that seem to have a knack of destroying belts, and now this brouhaha related to sale pricing. Not to mention the unichip debacle. Being a retailer of their parts must really suck sometimes. Oh, and I can also confirm that they are out of stock on the PSRS. I also have to wait three weeks even though I ordered a couple of hours after they announced the sale They surely did not have too many in stock.
You make alot of truthful statements. As a dealer the other problem we now have is any inventory we stock, we are now "stuck" with as no one will want to pay more than 50% off. I do admit I don't stock many alta parts do to those customer complaints. I prefer to advise customers of potential problems with a part and give them a known good alternative if there is one. So that also decreases our Alta sales.
I don't normally try to steer the conversational direction but in this case I'd ask you to try and get back on target and leave the methodology of the Alta sale out of this thread. I have no issue if you would like to create a new thread and discuss where they went wrong with this latest sale till the cows come home, the fat lady sings and that rolling does gather moss.
So what would the ideal bushing be? a firm rubber would be not too harsh, quiet, improve handling, but it would also eventually tear too right? a softer poly? you CAN keep poly quiet....trust me. teflon tape and a bunch of lube is nice. then offset it in someway for reduced anti-lift and maybe add caster? just thinking out loud.... - Andrew
I didn't find that the PSRS added much noise... at least when the sleeve isn't rattling! But with all things suspension, there is no best at all. Race on smooth tracks, then a solid bushing is best because it holds geometry. Drive on really crappy roads put-putting to and from the grocery store, and the softest rubber will be best. If the car isn't a track only car, I'm pretty sure the difference aren't that big once you get away from the fact that the stocker doesn't last.... Matt
I think that they all will get rid of the wandering on really hard breaking. Other than that, I think they are all good knives to skin this particular cat. Matt
I've installed countless sets of these. I've done all kinds, Powerflex, Alta, and OEM. And for my personal car I chose the Powerflex. Out of all of them I've installed I've NEVER had a complaint of noise. And out of ALL of them I've installed NEVER had a customer complain they were too hard. So I endorse them 100%. When the bushings aren't pressed in correctly you can get noise from them, so that is what I contribute to the people with PF with noise. As for the Alta's I've install much less in the number of sets, and those customers haven't complained of harsh ride. But some of them didn't like the extra noise. Also the gain with the extra caster/camber with them is so little 99% of customers can't even tell the difference. The only way you may tell is if you were tracking it, but % of time the car spends on the track versus being your daily driver is so small. People need to focus mods on what they do with the car 90% of the time, Not 10% of the time. You'll enjoy your car more. In reality I sell both brands, so either one a person purchases I will profit, but I would recommend the Powerflex first.
I’m going to take a guess Alta responded to loose PSRS sleeves in the V1 by under-boring the V2 sleeve so the user must press the sleeve on the control arm pivot shaft. Problem is there is nothing in the install instructions to prepare the installer and lots of material must be removed to allow the sleeve to fit. I tried to force the sleeve on the shaft after beveling the leading edge and it absolutely would not go, I ground away material at each corner ridge and thought it was enough; NOT! The sleeve stuck on the shaft and was very difficult to un-stick; it took me a couple frustrating hours to dislodge. For the other arm I ground much more material away including the weld blobs at the base (not shown), to get the sleeve to fit over the shaft, and far enough on to give something for the end set-screws to hold on to. A few things bother me about this issue, I repeat - there is no mention of the grind & file modification needed in the install instructions, the arm is now useless for a stock bushing if one wanted to return to OEM rubber, it is possible to grind away too much material causing the same sloppiness the close fit is supposed to eliminate, and the effort required to install these things has me really pissed off. I’m taking for granted these narrow sleeves were intentional and not a manufacturing goof. These are not on my car BTW.
i have had to grind a few. Alta told me that all there sleeves are the same size and that the control arms are sized different. i have only had to grind 2 or 3 sets to date, but after i do all the set screws i weld them up so nothing is going to be sloppy after.
I think the variance is do to the amount of "paint" on the arms. I noticed a lot of differences in the amount of force needed to fit these and all of the sleeves were the same size.
I think the arms are physically different in size. I had problems installing a couple sets and found the measurements of a couple sets of control arms to be different, and more than just paint. If your installing Alta bushings, be prepaired to grind them.
I just replaced my factory front Control Arm Bushings a couple weeks ago with the Powerflex (Purple in color) ones I purchased from Way Motor Works. They seem to be working great! I relied on the input from a friend that knows WAY more about the choices to help me select them, so I couldn't help with the pro's and con's of the others. Good luck!
Silly me, and here I thought all you had to do was drop the sub frame. Why is it that we get to the 18th page before this little bit of news about grinding on the FCA to fit the sleeve pop's up. dah Doesn't matter, they (PSRS) are going in anyway if the weather would cooperate.