:lol: Matt I see we are both up early today! **I received 2 e-mails yesterday asking about this product. One gave me this thread to check out. :lol: **"Lynn Have you ever heard of any good or bad results with these guys"? My response: "(name withheld) I have never heard from anyone that has actually tried their product and have never had one to examine so I am afraid I can not help you."
I'm not saying the product doesn't do anything. What I am saying is to be very suspect of the company, their claims and marketing tactics. Look at the big picture here not just the part. The company uses the terms "up to" in the ad copy with an incredibly large figure. It is copy such as this that raises flags on this product. They go on to quote a very larger MSRP with a incredible discount, again, this is something that raises a flag as to the practices of this company. I point again to the listing of product for cars that cannot use this such as that '57 Hudson Hornet. This again raised flags to the informed consumer. Then there is fact that for the Toyota Celica the same part number is used for all models from from 1978 to 2005. Another flag as we know that over that ~30 year run ECU's have changed some. The product may actually work, the marketing and manner the company uses is what makes them very suspect. Also... Their tactics online make them suspect as well. I'm one of that 0.0001% of people that will dig into the Whois, look at domain registration info and other web tricks to get to the bottom of things. The tactics they use online to hide themselves are beyond what the vast majority of legit outfits will do. Their online tactics are akin to the same ones used by the entities that offer ED solutions online. One has to ask why they need to cover their tracks like they do.
Installed one on a 1998 suburban. My customer brought it to me along with the other parts for a complete tune up. After my work he claimed he felt a power difference.We all know what from. As it turned out I had forgot to install the Tornado! Later I did the double blind test with him to see if he could in fact feel the difference. He clearly picked every time I installed it. So I got to thinking and removed the air cleaner assembly completely. He picked it as the tornado. So I knew it was the sound change created by the Tornado he heard not the feel. Did this test mean it did not work? Without a dyno I would not give a definitive answer. He thought it worked for him so he believed his money well spent?
Mythbusters Turbonator "The EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) and the FTC (Federal Trade Commission) both test and scrutinize products which claim better fuel efficiency like the Turbonator, Tornado and other similar vortex generators. They fully tested the Turbinator and Tornado along with many other products. In their findings not one of these vortex generators ever produced any gain whatsoever in either horsepower or fuel economy. Not one." Also look at this: "The large degree of fuel economy variance means that due to psychological factors of selective perception, consumers can be mislead as to the effectiveness of a device." [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_saving_devices"]Wikimedia Error[/ame] Nathan thank you for the information, I would not have thought to look at that aspect nor would I have had any idea how to do it? I look at the product itself and the surface claims by manufacture/suppliers if there is merit to there function of claim.
But they really DO like me... because, and I quote, "I've never had a man equipped like you before". :devil:
How to do this crap right if you really want to play with it. with the car running, look at the voltage you get across the temp sensor. You need to use a high impedance meter to do this, so the measurement doesn't screw the pooch. Then get some resistors, hack into the wiring to get to the temp leads. Try resistors until you get one that matches the stock voltage across it. To get fancy, get a potentiometer that goes to about 1.5x or 2x the resistor you chose. Try different settings with the thing, going in about 10%-20% steps, and use your favorite performance meter to log the differences. Be careful in your testing because very small amounts of heat soak will mask any benefit (I've found that idling for anything longer than about 20-30 seconds will start to sap a HP or two on a power run). Now, here's are the problems. The power delta will depend on ambient conditions because the car will now think that the intake temps are one thing, and this changes based on ambient temps and the like. What one is doing is tuning A/F a bit. There may be a bit of benefit from using gas as a water injection system as well (tried and true way of keeping boosted engines happy). But really, all one is doing is blinding the ECU to some real world changes, and then not letting the ECU do some of the conservative things that it's programmed to do because it's a street car. As far as the commercail thing, not everyone uses the same temp sensor, so how the heck can one resistance value cover all cars? If you get given one of these suckers, and want to screw with it, have at it. But if you want the full WOT benefit of fixing IAT inputs, you're not gonna get it with this sucker. Now Mike, I totally understand the desire for real world application knowledge, and I'm sorry that second hand isn't good enough for you. But really, you've got to at least have a basic understanding of how something works. Think of this as an electronic equivalent of changing the jets in a carb a little bit, without all the problems of poor atomization that too large a jet gives you. But what you are getting is a slight permenant change in jet size to a fixed size, instead of the dynamically sized jet equivalent that computer controlled FI can give you. With a crappy tune this might get you a tad of power. With a good tune, it will do nothing but degrate performance in some situations. And one comment on the marketing, any gain >0 but less than or equal to 60 hp is totally consistant with thier marketing claims. And you can be the ones that lost power don't post on the site! If you really want to lie to the ECU and change fuel without an ECU tune, get one of those Apexi units that can keep the dynamic nature of FI in play and not just lock down the ECU. Before the ECU was cracked, a lot of people ran the Apexi to good benefit. It's more than $60, but at least it works better. Matt
Matt........ That's kind of interesting what you proposed about adding a potentiometer. So if you had a A/F gage as a mod, this setup might allow you to make small manual adjustments to the richness while driving?
Paul, it does not say "equipped as well as you before". Might want to re-examine what she was trying to say. :cryin:
SOOoooooo.... no one has used this thing?? However there are a few that have strong opinions on its power increases ( as to how much vs the cost of a 15Cent resistor) yes?? But I guess $70.50 Per HP is a good thing.... or $80.00 Per HP is a good thing... or maybe $95.00 Per HP is a rocking deal!!?? And yet NO one here has stated any actual results ( with their use on a MINI, not a freaking 54 studabaker..) with the G Force!! Bummer. To those that really want to have an idea on the power increase, I guess it ain't happening. For those that like to be upset because they didnt think of it first.. and get stupid money for it, then this is the place!! I have one and in the future I will test it and see what it does on my Un tuned 06. Till then it is still a mystery!! PS: item 1 is a Schrick camshaft item 2 is a Header Item 3 is a catback system. K&N says "UP to 10 HP increase" ?? Tunes say 25-30 HP.?? Shell oil say it cleans your valves and give the best gas mileage.?? Spark plugs ( 15.00 each ) give you MORE power.?? See what I mean?? advertising is all misleading!! LOL Tpr.
You just don't get it do you. The site is so full of BS it creeps me out just to go there. I'm not pissed I didn't think of it, why, cause I have a shred of decency left to go with my morals. I understand making a profit, heck one day M/A might even too. But the way go about doing what they do is so off-putting and designed to just take your money. Go for it, spend $60 or $70 or whatever they charge for a buck fifty in rat shack parts to fool the ECU. Then again is this the best way to get more power? I think not as it screws with what is really going on. It's not at all dynamic and can't adjust to the real world.
Sometimes you just don't have to pick a turd up and roll it around in your hand to know it's crap.... Of course if one insist, have at it.
But according to previously mentioned Myth Busters, it is possible to polish a turd: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBj6PonX14A]YouTube - MYTHBUSTERS are going to Polish SHIT.......... they have gone nuts, remastered by NiteAngel[/ame]