R53 Most liked posts in thread: Let's Change Something !

Thank all of you !
Update : not the best one though .....
A friend of mine was kind enough to give me his car for the back to back test. I also wanted his comments on the way the car feels with the new charge pipe.


1st Measurement (OEM setup):

Fuel: 100 RON

Temperature: 17 degrees Celsius

Gear used: 5th

Closed bonnet.

The car was equipped with : Gp intercooler, 550 cc injectors, Bytetronik tune, high flow cat, exhaust, mynes v2 headers, detroid bypass, 16% sc pulley, stock charge pipe and intake.

And the number was ..... 163 at the wheels.

2nd Measurement:

Fuel:100 RON

Temperature: 21 degrees Celsius (by the end of the dyno section temp climb at 24 )

Gear used 5th.

Closed bonnet.

Power: 174 at the wheels (Am I happy ? No …. See why below….)

The car was equipped with : gp intercooler, 550 cc injectors, bytetronik tune, high flow cat, exhaust, mynes v2 headers, detroid bypass, 16% sc pulley, carbon fiber charge pipe and fiberglass heatshield.



I did 3 pulls each time. 3 with OEM setup and 3 with the new charge pipe. Unfortunately when measuring the carbon charge pipe the temperature was 21 (instead of 17) and by the end of the 3rd dyno section the temperature was 24 degrees Celsius outside. Car felt unwilling to rev in the first pull, second pull a bit better, third again a bit better…. Ok that was weird, I didn’t like it…. With this setup the car has done nearly 500km, maybe it needs some adaptation time ? I don't know.
Below you can see the graphs and.... my problem....




I became sad and upset initially…. The number peaks only at the rev limit, something completely unacceptable for me . I don’t chase numbers …. But the overall behavior. AND THIS THE WEIRD part …. The car feels amazing with the pipe !! It has torque from down low all the way to the rev limit, it pulls hard with aircon on and 42 degrees Celsius outside temperature. My friend couldn’t believe it , he felt the same, he told me “especially in the lower rev range there is a big difference, I like it way more now “!!!

The technician in the dyno, before checking the graphs he said to me “ it feels so much smoother and eager to pull” !!!! AWWWWW I will go crazy !!!

I did log the car during the dyno pulls and the logs say something completely different…. I think at least ...

IAT’s are down !! with 4 degrees Celsius more and the car heat-shocked in the first run.

Maximum IAT’s are down. Average IAT’s are down….






PSI values are up and the average psi values…

Air mass is up



So that's my situation now.. My friend wants to keep the pipe because .... the car feels better Me... I believe the car needs a re-tune... something is weird, or it needs more time, as in every pull it was better and better. Maybe I will do some pulls next week just to see. I am also planning to make a carbon fiber reinforced 3dprinted version, as changes will be faster (no need to wait for the carbon fiber moulds etc) in order to change the charge pipe outlet as I feel that can change the overall outcome .

Today after the dyno I reached my limit, thinking all the time and money that I spent. But now I feel better and I will try to figure the problem.
What do you think ? Ideas, comments and help are more than welcome !
Have an amazing night or day !

 

I was thinking.... what about the fuel... more boost, lower iats and more volume but same amount of fuel. Its not just an intake... I will install a afr gauge and retune and then try again.
What do you think ?

 

There are many depends on what you describe. A well designed intake will outperform an intake that is not so well designed, that's just physics and not tuning etc.
This is ofcourse the main reason a product should be tested not only in simulations or just a dyno room. Many many measurement have to be made in order to be sure.

 

There was a problem with one of the photos I wanted to upload in the previous post.
So here it is :

 

As much as I would like to just say yes.....it has to perform good enough in average values and not just pick numbers. So for now I am trying to enjoy the process as much as possible and focus on who it could be better.
The car it going to dyno next Thursday with the new printed model. So I want to see the dyno results plus the data logging.

 

I have the dyno results everybody This time I dyno my own car, first time with the printed charge pipe and second time with the oem setup. The intake was exactly the same both times ( filter, air box, air tubes), everything was OEM (only difference was thecharge pipe). I did in total 4 runs each time. 100 RON fuel, close hood same temperature (26 degrees).

Power:
Result.... there is in AVERAGE (4 runs) only 1 hp difference . Of course I can't consider that as a plus or minus.
Average 201 hp.

IAT:
It seems that with the printed model IATs are a bit lower. For example the 4th run : Printed charge pipe MAX=60 C , OEM MAX=63 C
Average values as very close during the whole run.

Average Air Mass kg/h:
4th run
OEM: 403 kg/h
Printed model: 414 kg/h

PSI:
Very close both

Conclusion:
No extra power for sure (that's the easiest to conclude). It seems that with the printed model the engine responded a bit better, lower IATs and maybe it breaths a bit better.
I was surprised that the carbon reinforced nylon printed model could take that abuse! I drove with it 1000 km , including fast driving at the mountain, heavy traffic in Athens with around 30 degrees Celsius outside and 4 dyno pulls So defiantly this material is up to the task and so useful for testing.

What's next?
Two versions:
Long pipe has considerable lower IATs (5 degrees down, with 4 degrees more outside temperature) and plus 12 whp at the redline... but average wise I am not happy at all. Yes it feels the best compare to everything else and the cars seems to pull way better especially at the very low end. Rookie mistake the outlet is smaller than the OEM Charge pipe...maybe that's the limiting factor.

Short charge pipe... just works ok. I mean it is basically the same with the OEM unit and with just a bit better IATs values. Do I feel the difference when I am driving? No . I can't really tell.

How should I proceed?
1) Print another long version but this time with revised outlet? Dyno again the car and lets see ?
2) For the short version, is the air box the limiting factor? People out there claim 10+ whp with just an airbox Should I designed a cheap airbox utilizing layser cut sheet metal and printed parts, with more volume ? Dyno again the car with OEM charge pipe plus the new airbox and then another dyno with the printed charge pipe plus the new air box. Compare all the data and decide ?
3)Should I stop the whole project and admit defeat ?

P.S
I am running extremely low on budget and I am getting tired and frustrated .

P.S 2
Most probably I would do something stupid, spend more money and time and try to figure out a way


Please I need your comments !!! Have a nice day or night !

 

I think nobody catch it... Next to the OEM R53 airbox is the R56 intake I designed a while ago (ofcourse just a 3dmodel, as budget doesn't allow me to continue more , for now at least )

 

Meaning even if the power figure are exactly the same as the OEM unit? It requires a lot of work to produce the charge pipe from carbon fiber and the cost is high. Me as George I do not want to produce something just to change the material (without any power benefits) and charge at least 3 times more the price of the OEM unit. It just doesnt make sense
Also I want to go faster

 

True !! But I like the style of it I wanted something different but still a closed box.

 

That's one hell of a car !

 

I uploaded a post in my personal blog post with all the details (most of them are in this thread as well) regarding the charge pipe. https://www.tpeprecision.com/post/product-release-r53-charge-pipe-kit

Of course guys you can ask anything you want in this thread as well, so everyone can see questions, answers etc.