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Discussion in 'Car Builds, Projects, Idea's Experiments' started by Precision Engineering, May 18, 2018.
I believe that Mighty Car Mods did a test on cold air intakes that didn't confirm popular beliefs.
There are many depends on what you describe. A well designed intake will outperform an intake that is not so well designed, that's just physics and not tuning etc.
This is ofcourse the main reason a product should be tested not only in simulations or just a dyno room. Many many measurement have to be made in order to be sure.
I printed a carbon fiber reinforced nylon charge pipe, mainly to see how the material behaves and how the print quality will turn out.
Rookie mistake.... the outlet of the charge pipe .... is a bit smaller than the OEM Unit and that's exactly how the car went to dyno... From what I understand nearly 2 years ago when I started slowly this project I initially design a mock up and then... never check it again. Ok not a big problem, I updated the CAD model although I already printed the CF nylon part Thus I will use it just for education reasons.
Love that Deadpool miniature ! Printed with resin, the detail is amazing.
That picture in the background looks familiar .... (later about that)
Previous week I started thinking what if I could use the OEM airbox, OEM filter, brackets etc. After a lot of thinking I decided to give it a try. It took 4 3d scans (which later became an assembly in order to have the engine bay, plus the frontal area of the car) and some days of designing. Dont forget that the base is similar to the previous version so the whole process was faster (plus some extra experience on my behalf compare to before). On the left you can see the 2 files (3dscanned and CAD model) on each other and on the right the new designed CAD model. Additionally there is no need for bumper spacers or a throttle cable extension like the other version. So here it is the new model:
And a picture showcasing the space between the fan and the charge pipe. All that is with a thickness of 3mm compare to 2mm before.
View attachment 43754
The model is already at the printer, meaning it should be ready in the next 2 days. And of-course by using Cf nylon that means I can drive and dyno the car with the printed model !! So all the updates will be faster now !
So what do you think guys ? Does it worth all that extra trouble? Is it a better solution-option compare to the other version? I loved it just for it's simplicity. Tell me your comments and thoughts !
There was a problem with one of the photos I wanted to upload in the previous post.
So here it is :
Printed model is ready!
With a 20% carbon fiber and 80% nylon weight ratio the model is super strong and ready for some real world driving! Below some photos with the printed model next to the OEM unit.
Test Fitment photos !!
Keep in mind now only the charge pipe is changed and the vacuum lines (instead of plastic high pressure ones), everything else is original no bumper spacers, no cable extension, oem airbox, filter, even the bypass silicone hose is OEM . With everything back on, you can not understand something is changed.
What do you think ? Do you like this alternative? I will update you soon with comment on how it drives, logs and dyno pulls.
Have a nice day !
Good work I like it.
Looks very nice, clean and professional. As usual thanks for the detailed write ups. You can do soo much with a 3D printer these days!
Thank you for the kind words. I try to write many info, although I feel sometimes I could explain more or better I will try more. 3d printers are amazing !! They are so helpful. But to be honest most of the credits go... to the 3d scanner ...you save so much time and elliminate errors. For instance for this version I 3dscanned the engine bay without bumper, then with bumper and last the oem charge pipe. Afterward you assembly all the files and you have a digital model of your working space in your computer! Ofcourse it is not a cad model just a point cloud which means a lot of design effort is needed. I will try to upload more technical information, as I feel people like to read about it !
I went for a test drive 2 hours ago. It feels nice , there are differences with the previous version but I will wait for the data from the dyno and road logging in order to say for sure. For now I can say the previous version feels so so nice at low rpm, especially in city driving but this one feels better at the high rpm range. We will see next week !
So is this something you plan on selling eventually?
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As much as I would like to just say yes.....it has to perform good enough in average values and not just pick numbers. So for now I am trying to enjoy the process as much as possible and focus on who it could be better.
The car it going to dyno next Thursday with the new printed model. So I want to see the dyno results plus the data logging.
So the last 2 weeks I am playing a bit more with designing. I decided I want to have as many parts as possible in CAD models, as it really helps and.... it is fun (plus a bit nerd with designing !! )
The parts I added to my library recently is the bypass valve, intercooler and intercooler horn. All these parts where 3dscanned and then completely redesigned creating CAD models.
Lets start with the intercooler, just a normal r53 cooper s cooler . Below you can see the 3d model versus the real model.
The stickers you see on the intercooler are there in order to help the scanner track the object a bit better. Just in case you wonder, I scanned it with a resolution of 0.3mm, which is more than enough for what I need! Below you can see the scanned file. This file consist of many polygons and it is called an stl file (or obj) and it is a mesh file.... which is let's say the most useless file for an engineer at least!
I want all my models to be as close to reality as possible not only dimension wise but appearance as well. It might take some extra time to finish but I feel it worth it !
Yeap I designed the stickers....
Bypass Valve ...:
Apparently it is a Dellorto ! I had no idea, I know this brand from motorcycles !
And the driver's intercooler horn.
Trying my render skills
And some random captures :
Still I have to do the whole OEM Intake system, meaning the airbox, airfilter and intake tubes, I also 3dscanned the front crash member for a future project I have in mind and ... I am playing around with an R56 but I will leave that for later !! Next update is going to be the new dyno results, graphs, comments etc ! I hope you enjoyed this post , have a nice day or night ,
Very cool and awesome.
Looking forward to what you do next!
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I would use a GP intercooler to model. It’s the best one for the mini. All the others get heat socked and take too much time recovering.
Your doing a great jog this is a very entrusting thread.
I agree with Lee don’t bother with “stock” IC get you hands on an OEM GP IC and scan that one.
It has been test and proven to be the best IC out of all IC many times. Including resisting heat soak and recovery times. All of the aftermarket IC including M7, ALTA, AIRTEC and GRS and manny others are NOT better than the OEM. They all make a great “Hail Mary” Dyno pull that they advertise but haetsoak, pressure drop and do not recover anywhere close to the OEM and the GP IC.
Also, to really cool the air intake charge I run a GP IC and a Aquamist HFS-3 100% methanol injection kit right after the IC. I use VP M-1 Methanol. As far as IC design, nothing will reduce temps as will as Meth plus the octane boost and clean valves are added benefits.
Oh and I have a fix for the “Milltek”sway. When you drive your car the exhaust tips will move to the passenger side and be off center. This drove me nuts being OCD. The fix is .79 cents.
Go to any hardware store and buy 2 small worm style hose clamp the size of the hangers or a little larger.
Next when your exhaust is installed in perfect place the hose clamps on the exhaust hanger bar inside and outside of one of the inside hanger. (by Battary box) you only need to do one side.
Tighten them down and take it for a ride or do a bunch of circles left and right in a empty parking lot. When you get out and look the exhaust tips should not have moved at all.
Tottaly agree about the GP cooler. But in my car I have an OEM unit. No matter what, it is good to have it in my library. Me too I would prefer a GP intercooler.
Hay Dave, did you mean to put this here?
I made my own GP style intercooler. While I was making it I had an "engineer" keep telling me the tensile strength of aluminum vs JB Weld but he finally shut up when I reminded him that the intercooler is held in place via two rubber boots. Yes some portions would have been easier with a welder but I don't have. Have pressure tested it to 35 psi and after several months of use no issues. The black at the side rails is JB Weld.
I also found that the oem scoop seal was not tight so I added some extra weather seal.
From my construction experience I am aware that certain coatings can help heat dissipation depending on the type of heat radiation. From what I read, the coatings that are out there now for intercoolers and or headers work in normal "radiate" conditions. For the intercooler the coatings would help during the times the car is stopped but once "convection" occurs the coatings really don't do much. I also know that paint has almost no impact on convection cooling. I like the silver intercooler cover with a black intercooler.
Last, when doing dyno pulls it is difficult to have sufficient air flow across the intercooler. I made up a shroud that in conjunction with my leaf blower can be attached to the stock intercooler. As with any mechanical blower/fan, air temperatures are impacted by the static/pressure. The higher the pressure, the warmer the air is. I found that I could obtain upwards of seven degree cooler air when I used the low speed fan setting on the leaf blower.
Spraying Meth after any OEM IC will provide more cooling than any larger or modified IC.
Also Meth increases octane and cleans valves.