Now that this has become the clownshoe thread, back to the original topic. I think "area under torque curve" / weight (or something similar) would be a more accurate comparator of real performance. Peak HP doesn't mean all that much. Area under torque curve really drives the size of your GPness.
Back on topic Thanks to Blimey for noting that this wasn't a Clown Shoe discussion (although I enjoyed seeing the photos of nicely modded BMW coupes). My intention was not just to begin a discussion of horsepower, but a discussion of car manufacturers moves to create a Halo Effect* by producing, marketing, and selling a car with performance that is at the top of the class. M/A members would rather own an R53 or a Clown Shoe than the new generation of MINIs, but the current cars produced effect brand image of all MINIs. While Ford will sell only a few Focus RSs, the image of all Focuses will be changed by this car. New Focus buyers will feel that they are getting something much better than an ecnobox. Auto enthusiasts will view the Ford Focus in a more positive manner. If MINI holds the bottom position of performance in the hot hatchback category, MINI will not be viewed by most of the public as a performance car. While we enjoy and extol the handling capabilities of our cars, lateral G's and slalom times don't generate as much press and power figures. *Halo Effect - The halo effect is a cognitive bias in which an observer's overall impression of a person, company, brand, or product influences the observer's feelings and thoughts about that entity's character or properties. Wikipedia
MINI or Mini was never known for high HP. Nimble cars yes, rocket ships, not so much. There is a bit a of cultural difference between us "Muricans" when it comes to vehicle dynamics. Our wide open spaces allow for the massive size and grunt that defines performance to most people.
It all boils down to seat time. You can have all the HP available but if seat time is not there, even the fastest cars will be slow. I've seen R50s tear up the Dragon and other twisties, namely because their drivers knew how to "git-er-done".
I'm familiar with what a halo car is... That being said. MINIs have never been about all out performance, as Nathan said. Fun, yes. Zippy, yes. Great handling, you betcha. But speed and power? No.
Agreed that the total performance experience in a MINI/Mini is a complex combination of handling, style, history. Interesting, though, that eveyone who has argued that horsepower in not important has either spent much money and time to increase the horsepower in their car or spent the extra $$ to purchase the MINI with the greatest horsepower.
This is the great irony, and I'm guilty of it. The MINI at it's heart is like the Miata; it's all about handling first, power second. But, both cars can handle so much more HP on the chassis, and, as many of us like the wolf in sheep's clothing aspect to the whole thing. There is something to taking a (relatively) slow car and turning it into something altogether different. And although it's not what the MINI represents in stock form, it does stay true to the MINI heritage in that part of the appeal of the original MINI was modding it to perform on the track. At the end of the day, even highly modded, most MINI's aren't insanely overpowered. Seriously, 300WHP in a MINI is considered extreme. That is nothing compared to modded Subie's, M3's, Porsche's, Mustang's, Corvettes, etc. Even modded, we're not super fast in a straight line. But give the MINI just a bit more oomph, and the car is hellacious on the track, and can run quicker lap times than many cars with much more HP, similar to the Miata. It get's back to the HP/Weight ratio we were talking about; a car like the MINI and Miata, because they are so light, are an excellent platform to mod to become a giant killer. The beauty of the MINI is it's a great car to learn on before you decide to touch it. Once you get comfortable with what the car can do, how to drive it fast as a momentum car, then start adding more power to it, it's really a rewarding way to become a good driver.
I haven't spent a dime on increasing horsepower, FWIW. Adding a ton of power to this car would just overpower the front tires and would be an entire waste everywhere but the highway. I bought the GP, because it's the best answer for what I want in a car right now. I've grown tired of having to modify every vehicle I purchase - the GP has everything done right out of the box: - Coilovers - Camber - Exhaust - Rear seat delete - Rear wiper delete - A little extra power, but nothing crazy - Better seats - Extra bracing, aero, and none of the complicated tomfoolery you get in a 'fully loaded JCW' It was nothing about the power. It's more about the raw, visceral feeling this car provides when I drive it. I like my cars to be razor sharp and focused, I don't want them to coddle me in a bubble of complete isolation. The best part is that I essentially have a sports car that can haul a bit of crap in the back when needed, or throw bikes on top. I can't do that with a Miata or even a FR-S or BRZ.