Death rattle, dieseling, etc.
After writing this post I decided to move the last part to the top so that everyone can cut to the chase for some useful information. Then if they want they can read the rest to see how I came to my opinions. Here’s to better luck with your Mini than I’ve had with mine. As much as I’ve enjoyed driving it I’ve hated owning it. I’m getting rid of it with no remorse and I don’t see another MINI or BMW in my future at any point.
I’ve learned that:
When a Mini dealer says something is caused by ‘bad gas’ that what they actually mean is “we think you are an idiot and you’ll believe thisâ€.
When a Mini dealer says it is a “normal noise†that they actually mean, you guessed it, “we think you are an idiot and you’ll believe thisâ€. (If my technically advanced Mini/Bmw sounds like it has a bag of rocks bouncing around in the engine when it starts up then I, for one, really don’t want a Mini or a BMW!)
When your Mini dealer says “we can’t replicate the noise†It means either “you are lying†or “we really don’t want to hear about it unless it breaks and we have to do something. Maybe it will hang in there until your warranty expires.†However when you do bring it in after the warranty has expired and they can hear the sound then they look at you like an idiot for continuing to drive something that sounds so bad. Even when you tell them that the noise is still intermittent and it was totally quiet on the way in they react in a way that lets you know, you guessed it, “you are lyingâ€.
If you are having the death rattle and you are still under warranty you need to “bitch your head off†to get it fixed under warranty. Apparently being very assertive multiple times over 3 years just doesn’t do the trick.
The engine death rattle can lead to the timing chain jumping or breaking and then the valves running into the pistons which in turn leads to a repair bill for $8,000 for a new engine. I supposed I would have had to pick up 30% (or 40% if they learn how to do math right. Read the whole story to see what this means). I did not know that death rattle could lead to complete engine failure until very recently when I started reading several forums.
MINI USA really doesn’t give a ****, but apparently some dealers are better than mine.
If you own or are going to buy a Mini or a BMW you need to budget to replace it often enough to keep it under warranty. These cars are not especially reliable (as many independent ratings now show), they are very expensive to fix (you’ve seen your warranty invoices or worse you’ve paid to have the dealer fix something so you know how painful that is), and finally these are fragile cars in the sense that their sophistication leads to one small problem leading to a big one, i.e. the vacuum pump problem can also cause an engine to be destroyed. Also unless you are lucky enough to live close to your dealer you have to deal with long trips for service and the inconvenience of dropping off your car during normal hours if you want a loaner. Once you are out of warranty then of course you have no loaner. So in my case I’ve been without my MINI this time for 2 weeks due to waiting to get in for service and then it taking the dealer an inordinate amount of time to fix it even though they didn’t need to order parts. This inconvenience turned out to be a much greater irritation than I expected when I bought the car. Of course one reason for this was that the Mini had to go back to the dealer multiple times under warranty where the last two new cars I bought only when back to dealer for warranty work one time EACH. I kept my 99 Isuzu Trooper for 160,000 miles and the only non-maintenance items it has needed were a radiator at over 120,000 and a starter at 150,000. At that kind of mileage and age of over 10 years even those could be viewed as maintenance. I still own my 2004 Chevy Tracker (Suzuki Grand Vitara) with 103,000 miles. I had to replace the alternator at about 95,000.
Since MINI won’t even admit to the death rattle problem they cannot really come out and advertise that the problem is fixed for current models. In my review of various forums I only see reports for 07, 08, 09, and 10. However the 11’s and 12’s may simply not have enough miles on them to have had this problem yet. There are also forums for other brands that use this engine in Europe and there are lots of reports of the death rattle there too. Since I haven’t read every post on every forum there may be reports from 11 and 12 models. Therefore I’m relatively certain the death rattle is still a concern.
I had test driven an 11 MCS to see what more horsepower felt like and especially to try out the electronic limited slip. The electronic limited slip eliminated torque steer and made the MCS more like the first generation, which is a good thing. However, even now if I could resign myself to buying a new car every four years (I usually keep mine 8 to 10 years) I wouldn’t get a MINI or BMW knowing what I know now.
So here’s the story:
Thought I’d post this so others could decide what to do. I have a 07 MCS that I purchased in March of 2007. The timing chain tensioner completely failed at 20,000 with no warning in June of 08. There were no morning rattles or anything. I just driving the car, came down from speed to idle and the engine sounded like a bag of rocks. If I ran the revs up to 3,000 rpms the centrifugal force took up the slack and the engine quieted down except for the light rubbing of the chain on the case. The chain, tensioner, etc. was replaced under warranty.
A few months and a few thousand miles later the dieseling death rattle began. It was very random with no discernable ‘triggers’ as others have found. The outside temperature could be hot or cold. I could park it level in the garage or nose up in the driveway. It could sit a short time or for a week. Nothing seems to make a difference. It rattles on start up whenever it feels like it for varying lengths of time from 30 seconds to a few minutes.
I complained about the noise at every service and even took it into service just for the noise. One time I took it in for just the rattle and left it for several days. At various times we were told that it was “bad gas†and a “normal noiseâ€, but we were always told “that they could not replicate the noiseâ€.
Now, December of 2011, after the car is out of warranty it made the death rattle so loud it trippedf the ‘half yellow engine’ warning so I took it and dropped it off on a Sunday evening.
I called the dealer on Monday morning and asked if they were able to hear the noise. The service adviser said yes, of course it was very loud. I told him it was quiet as could be on the way down. From his reaction he obviously didn’t believe me. He said the replacement of the tensioner/chain would cost $1,550, but he’d call MINI and see if they would do anything.
I told him it had been intermittently rattling for over 3 years and if he looked back at the service records he’d see that we complained about it at every service, took it in specifically just for the noise, and even took it in and left it for several days. I told him I expected MINI to cover EVERYTHING since it should have been replaced under warranty at one of the many times we complained. I should note here that after not hearing from the service adviser I had to call him back to see what they had found out.
The next day at 5:30, after I had left work, the service advisor called and left a message to let me know that MINI would cover 40%, the dealer would cover 20%, and I was to pick up 30%. I listened to it twice to make sure I was hearing it right since you will note that the numbers only add up to 90%. (Apparently that can’t even do that right).
I called back the next day and before I could say anything the service adviser said he knew the numbers he had given me didn’t add up to 100%, but that I’d only have to cover 30% (very smart move on his part) and that also the work would be at warranty rate so that the total would be much less than $1,550.
So I had to wait nearly a week until I could take the car in, they had it beginning on a Monday, had the parts in stock and promised it for Wednesday. Late Wednesday they called to say they could not have it done, but were pretty sure they could have it done on Thursday. I told them it was OK if they finished Friday because I couldn’t get all the way to the dealer until Saturday. Of course they called late Friday to let me know that it wouldn’t be ready until Monday and “was that OKâ€. I replied that “I eally don’t have any choice do I?â€
Hopefully it is done tomorrow.
Hopefully it doesn’t rattle anymore.
Hopefully someone else owns it when the latest tensioner/chain wears out.
Hopefully ‘someone’ can get MINI to fix it again.
Page 2 of 2
Page 2 of 2