Brakes Wheels 1st Gen Tires Thoughts on next wheel/tire setup for the track

Discussion in '1st Generation: 2002–06 R50, R53 & 2004–08 R52' started by BlimeyCabrio, Aug 16, 2014.

  1. UKCoopeR

    UKCoopeR Active Member

    May 21, 2009
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    I am totally addicted to the 15" wheel kool-aid, the acceleration difference is repeatable and measurable. I just sold the last of my 16s, like you said tires were getting tough to find, I know 225-45-16 on a 16x8 would rub for me and 225-50-16 had no chance of fitting so I stuck with 205-50 and 205-45 on 16x7 but the extra 20mm I got going to 15s meant overheating the tires was much harder, I am lowered though so fitment will vary.

    My recommendation for the on a budget method would be 15x8 and 225/45/15 nt-01s which is what I run :) I agree 9/8 will be faster but I rotate my tires front/rear and left/right once a day because the wear is uneven and it lets me get the most out of the tires. If I was trying harder I would run A7s on 9/8 and do 3-lap stints but I wouldn't have as much fun despite dropping seconds off my times and importantly for my budget the $$$ adds up.

    You can keep the 16x7s and have them as your back-up rain/drive to the track set. That is what I did with mine (I ran 205-50-16 Z1*) And 'taller' gearing means the drive to the track is at slightly lower rpm.
     
  2. CarlB

    CarlB Active Member

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    Thank you for the answer. I have been concerned about the increase in scrub radius. Have you had more problems with the power steering than normal, or noticed any other differences? What did you do to clear the rear wheel well lip? Thank you for the help
     
  3. cct1

    cct1 Well-Known Member
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    You'll rub the wheel arch trim on the back with 8's, and a little on the fronts.

    It's self correcting. It wears off. Or just take a dremel and remove the bottom of the inner lip of the arch trim--you can't see it anyway, so cosmetically it's not an issue.

    No rubbing on the liner, it's just the arch.

    You're at speed at the track, it really doesn't affect the power steering except at low speeds, and even then, it's not much.
     
  4. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    And amount of rub in the rear is directly dependent on how low you're running.

    I'm running 225/50R16's (huge by comparison to 225/45R15's) and only had to deal with a bit of rubbing as cct1 described. But I suspect I'm running higher, also. I'm on Bilstein Sports / Swift springs, not coilovers. A good bit lower than stock, but not "low". :)

    Right now my #1 priority is to wear out these huge frickin tires as quick as I can so I can get new 225/45R16 ZII Star Specs for the street / rain. :)
    They didn't have 45's when I bought my current ones...
     
  5. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    cct1 - curious - approx how many days / sessions were you getting out of NT01's?

    Just wondering how many sets to buy when available. :D
     
  6. cct1

    cct1 Well-Known Member
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    When I had 8's on all four corners and I could rotate them, about 8-10 days, it's track dependent though. Road America is gentle on tires, Blackhawk kills them, especially the left front, Autobahn and Gingerman are in between.

    If you can't rotate because your run the 8's and 9's, the rears last forever, the fronts about half as long.

    I really, really miss them, I can't wait to get another set, maybe shaved the RA1's would be just as good, but the Nitto's can't be beat for the price and the out of the box ready to go-ness.

    I'll probably start running Hoosier knock offs (Miata's use them for practice/time trials, then sell them used for roughly 100 bucks a tire, with only a few laps on them--so they're all scuffed in and ready to go, and cheap) full time though next year, we'll see.
     
  7. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    Cool - that helps. Thanks.
    I suspect I'll run 8's all around next season if I can get them to fit. Then move up to the stagger later. Will be a little while before I can out-drive the 8's all around. :Thumbsup:
     
  8. UKCoopeR

    UKCoopeR Active Member

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    If you take tire temps that can help you extend the life of them, at some tracks I run asymmetrical pressures in order to get even temps. The real racers even run asymmetrical alignments! I am not quite that hardcore yet. With my local tracks being Summit/Shenandoah/VIR/CMP I get ~10-12 days, but I usually go to Shenandoah as it is the one I find to be the most fun and is the closest to my house and it isn't too bad on tires.
    If nt-01s can't be found when i next need some I might try the 205 SM7 (they run wide for a 205 and I trip over 20+ spec miatas every event lol)
     
  9. cct1

    cct1 Well-Known Member
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    #29 cct1, Aug 19, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2014
    I have to run asymmetrical pressures--starting cold, left front is lowest, then right front, then left rear, then right rear (although I can usually run the rear tires pretty close). Depends on the track and ambient temps, but I usually shoot for 35-36 hot on the Nittos on the fronts, and 34-35 on the rears, seems to work best for me. Some people like a little more pressure, some a little less. I'd like to try the Nittos at a little higher pressure, up to 38, now that I can check segment and lap times accurately--I've had many people tell me a given tire pressure may feel slower, but the lap times may be faster, it felt slower to me at higher pressures on the nittos before I was measuring times but the telemetry won't lie.

    I cooked the RA1s last Friday, never got them consistent--I hit 42 psi at one point, the extra tread really makes a difference, came in early to check them once it felt like I was on an ice rink. Dropped them down and they were much better, I should be able to choose a better cold temp next time. But each time out the temps were all over the place; I can usually start the Nittos around 27-28 cold and get pretty consistent temps and pressures all day.
     
  10. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    I heart this thread.
     
  11. UKCoopeR

    UKCoopeR Active Member

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    I use basically the same pressures as cct1, i usually start between 26-28 cold (the rear and less used side are on the higher end of the range) depending on the track and temperature and sometimes make a couple of adjustments after my first session to end up at ~34-36 hot (the front and more used rear are on the higher end of the range)

    I am happy to share AiM data with anyone that is interested. I have only done Summit and Shenandoah with my mini since getting telemetry (other tracks are in other people's cars) so that might not be relevant. My best at Shenandoah is 1:43.9 (with some hack driving) and 1:26.2 on Summit (again the looking at the data makes it obvious how hack my driving is lol). I have video for the Shenandoah lap on my computer that I will upload this weekend
     
  12. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    Found this awesome review by a very credible performance tire expert for the NT01:
    :arf::lol::lol::lol:
     
  13. cct1

    cct1 Well-Known Member
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    LMAO--it's for people like that that the "Darwin Awards" exist.
     
  14. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    Posting this here also, because I love this thread so much.

    Thanks SO MUCH to cct1, UKCoopeR and others who helped figure this out and led me along. I'm so stoked to have real tiger paws for Locutus for my next track day.

    And I'm REALLY thankful to have good guidance on starting temps, etc. You guys are awesome.

    I ended up with these:

    [​IMG]

    949 racing 6UL, Tungsten finish, 15x8. Nitto NT-01 225/45R15.

    [​IMG]

    If you need to know why, go back and read this thread. :D
     
  15. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    #35 BlimeyCabrio, Jun 1, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2015
    By the way, since I mentioned it earlier in this thread last year... and if you've been reading closely you probably assume this already...

    The 6UL 15x8 wheels DO fit over the Detroit Tuned 16" BBK. Thanks to cct1 for loaning me a spare wheel for a test fit.
    [​IMG]

    It requires 12mm spacers and long studs... and it's close, and you don't want any wheel weights near the caliper... but it works.

    I let Chad and team know.
     
  16. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    #36 BlimeyCabrio, Jun 2, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2015
    And here are my new ones, mounted. Turns out I only needed 12mm spacers in the front, and 3mm in the rear (just to provide clearance from lower shock mount). I updated the post above.

    [​IMG]

    Pic below is with 5mm spacers in the rear, I'm waiting on 3mm to arrive. So much wheel gap, nothing should rub anyway... :cool:
    [​IMG]
     
  17. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    By the way, this season I dropped back to 225/45R16 ZII Star Specs for the street. That size was much better than the 50's, less rubbing and better all around. Went through about 2/3 of the fronts in 5 days at MOTD. Now rotated, should last me though the rest of the year. :D
     
  18. Dave.0

    Dave.0 Helix & RMW Powered
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    How could you use up 2/3rds in a few days only going 30 mph. :eek::devil:
     
  19. BlimeyCabrio

    BlimeyCabrio Oscar Goldman of MINIs
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    I only drove the Dragon 1.5 times...

    Some of the other places we drive have slightly higher speed "limits"... :devil:
     
  20. TheModFather

    TheModFather Well-Known Member

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    Same way my new R-S3's are on their wear bars... 6-7 Dragon runs, Twice up the Skyway, more runs on Hellbender and the south 40 of 28 than I can count, plus a few roads nobody either knows about, or doesn't talk about (thanks to a tip from a local at the Shell in Robbinsville) plus the 1300 miles each way to get there. (The road trip out wasn't even enough to take the lettering off of the center tread bar.)

    Either way, I am impressed with the Hankooks! They do take a lower tire pressure than I ran with the Nitto's (so they would heat up faster here in the CO canyons), and will slide easily on smooth concrete roundabouts now that they are worn. All in all, I will be running the R-S3's again because of the price point and overall performance. :D
     

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