2nd Gen R56 Cooper S Most liked posts in thread: What's faster.....

I agree, stock to stock. Having owned both a stock 03S and a 09S, the 09 "seems" to be much quicker, never actually timed them. But the pull of that, "little" turbo, even with an auto, was impressive. I had to spend a few, LOL, bucks to pass up my wife in her 09. That being said, my 03 still "felt" better than the 09, stock to stock. After all my suspension mods, that gap as widened even further. Though when she is not in the car I am getting more confident in it.

 

The R56 feels softer

and probably has more body roll, but it's faster in a turn as well. Doesn't feel faster though. That's the difference between perception and reality. I'm guessing the R56 has less roll stiffness to appeal to more drivers.

And it takes a different driving style as well. The SCed car pulls on and on till you hit the rev limiter, the turbo'ed car pulls much harder down low, but runs out of lungs at about 5500 or so. this makes the R53 feel like a faster car as well.

FWIW, on most roads, you want the softest suspension that you can get away with so that you can keep the tires in contact with the road. But it doesn't feel faster to have a soft suspension.

Anyway, these are the food-stuffs of "Ultimate Bench Racing 2010" or whatever. As more and more mods come out for the suspension of the R56 and the tuners get much better at tweaking the ECU (DI and cam timing really opens up the world of possibilities) with aftermarket turbos, they will outdistance more and more of the R53s. But it's early in the game.

For most of us, it doesn't matter at all. It's not a question about lap times, it's about driving enjoyment. Want the perception of speed, drive a Triumph Spitfire, or a car like my old Fiat 124 spider. They were very slow, but you sat so close to the ground. This just FEELS faster.

Driving pleasure and performance are sometimes less coupled than one thinks.

Matt

 

I addressed the suspension first off on mine and took out the stock roll with TSW Springs, JCW front/rear sway bars, JCW Struts. JCW Strut Brace Bar and a set of Rear Lower Control Arms. Is that "feel good"?. Sure is fun thats fer sure! :cornut:

Friend here locally offered his 04 MCS to drive. Need to test out to see the diffs

 

I have to agree with the Doc. Now this is not an apple to apple comparison, but my 03 R50 "feels" like it's going faster than our 08 Clubman S. Going on the same twisty road, same road conditions, same speeds, the 08 is so much smoother.

Mark

 

Since the basic suspension design between the generations is very similar, the easiest way to emulate the R53's steering feel is to add Anti-Dive and lower the roll center up front [read: ALTA PSRS and lowered ride height]. After that, reprogramming the awfully artificial electric steering assist would help tons. From there, changing damping, springs, and swaybars to taste is easy.

Spot on. A perfect example is the Miata; it's among the best "feeling" sports cars ever and it's slow compared to most metrics. The flipside is a BMW 335i is impressive on paper and can put down solid lap times but is infuriatingly insulated from behind the steering wheel. As driving enthusiasts we simply must keep reminding ourselves that joy from the drivers seat is far more important to our mental health than lap times and power-to-weight ratios.

 

just struck me with the thought of if we were having this discussion on the 'sewing site'....... grateful for MA

 

You should have been around just before the 2nd gens were released, and all the bashing/name calling/fighting that was going on over there. Those were dark days

But here in the light, we can carry on "discussions" with wide POV, with no problems.

Mark

 

Still a little dicey on the political front but other than that I agree

 

Ya play the game, ya gotta take yer lumps:lol:

Mark

 

Yep, four pages in and nobody's called anyone a "Panty Waste" yet...LOL

 

it's ironic that the same thing happened when the '08 Subaru STI (GRB) was released. The old school owners (GDB chassis) called it 'soft' while the new owners defended it as a more balanced, more mature car. It's every bit as fast, but handles infinitely better and doesn't beat you up. It doesn't feel fast, sort of like how an R56 is sneaky while an R53 lets you know thing with more clarity.

Things got so bad on IWSTI.com that the mods and admins had to say 'no more GRB bashing or bannination'.

 

That's my philosophy:lol: It's not turbocharged and it won't set any track records, but it's a blast to drive

 

You're a Panty Waist.

Frickin pansy hairdressers.... who let that guy in here?
:devil:

 

Thats right!

 

Who let you in here??? It was all warm and fuzzy, and you start with the name calling :incazzato:Now we will have to talk about sewing:cryin:

:smilewinkgrin:

Mark

 

Have owned and tracked both a R53 and a R56. The R56 is faster because it has more torque and can get out of the turns with more speed. This was confirmed whan I was at the track with my R56 with a CAI and air diverter to the intercooler and a friend had a R53, pulley, CAI and exhaust, both on R compounds. We both noticed that the R56 was faster. When we followed each other the R56 is faster out of the turns.