Hey guys, Looking for some input on what might at first appear to be one of the standard wheel tire questions. I am very happy with my dry track setup 225-45-15 nt-01s what I am thinking about is a semi dual use setup which would be for driving to and from the track and be used on track if there is standing water or if the nittos get too worn. I don’t have a trailer so I have the nt-01s in the back seat and the other set on the mini on the way to and from the track so something like r wets are out of consideration. Currently I am using 205-50-16 original star specs for this role. I have heard people say narrow tires are better for rain which makes sense but these might get used in the dry on occasion which is why I thinking of moving away from my current setup as I sometimes overheat the star specs in the dry trying to force them to produce times like my nt-01s which I know is my fault but I would like something that is fun in dry and good in the rain. This mix of use had me looking at other tires like Michelin Super Sports as a good wet and dry tire. Tires like the rs-3s etc would be better in the dry but not as good in the wet. The fact that not all the tires come in the same sizes then opened up the wheel diameter choice. A much more experienced racer than me said pick the tire size and compound that meets your needs first. I am about 1 inch lower than stock so was looking at outer diameters between 23” and 24” for the best tradeoff of fitting and gearing. I don’t want to go overboard with the budget given this is the back-up. So things like kosei or 949 are more likely than custom forgelines lol 205-50-15: Dunlop ZII ($390), Kumho XS ($430), Bridgestone RE-11A ($450), BFG Rival ($470), Toyo R1R ($490), Yokohama AD08 ($520) 225-45-15: Hankook RS-3 ($450), BFG Rival ($525), Toyo R1R ($550) 205-45-16: Toyo R1R ($580) 205-50-16: Conti Extreme DW ($340), Dunlop ZII ($475), Toyo R1R ($560) 215-45-16: Kumho XS ($450) 225-45-16: Dunlop ZII ($460), Toyo R1R ($625) 205-45-17: Conti Extreme DW ($410), Dunlop ZII ($610), Michelin Super Sport ($650), Bridgestone RE-11 ($660), Yokohama AD08R ($730) 215-40-17: Dunlop ZII ($560), Yokohama AD08R ($750)
I like my Nitto Neo Gens, in size 205-50-15, on holeys...so much that I am considering them on my 16" R84s, too.
I always had good experiences with my Star Specs in the rain, 215/45-17. Just add a couple extra pounds of air pressure to round out the tire profile and make the contact patch slightly narrower. They were good in driving rain to about 100 mph, but at that point I just need more aero. Which brings up another point - stick a strong splitter and and bigger wing on your car and you can run any extreme performance street tire with decent tread depth.
wmwny thanks for the suggestion but I think the neogens are a little below what I am looking for in terms of grip, do you have troubling giving it full gas out of tight turns with 205 sections? any overheating? BThayer, I hadn't even considered the impact adding downforce would have! That is a good point. I tried to do some local optimization in each diameter in a bang for buck sense to make the comparison a bit less messy... 15": 15x7 Kosei K4R with 205-50-15 Dunlop ZII ~$962 ~30lbs 23.1OD 4 Sidewall 15": 15x7 Kosei K4R with 205-50-15 Bridgestone RE-11A ~$1032 ~32lbs 23.1OD 4 Sidewall 16": 16x7.5 Kosei K4R with 205-50-16 Conti Extreme DW ~$976 ~33lbs 24.1OD 4 Sidewall 16": 16x7.5 Kosei K4R with 225-45-16 Dunlop ZII ~$1098 ~37lbs 24 OD 4 Sidewall 17": 17x7 Kosei K1 TS 205-45-17 Conti Extreme DW ~$1200 ~34lbs 24.3OD 3.6 Sidewall 17": 17x7 Kosei K1 TS 215-40-17 Dunlop ZII ~$1342 ~37lbs 23.8 OD 3.4 Sidewall I do have a set of 16x7 already but the mesh design has me looking for a swap as cleaning them takes forever lol so staying with 16s doesn't necessarily help out with the budget :-/
I understand what you are saying/asking. I guess I was not clear enough when I talked about the Neo Gens and the holeys. They are my to the track, during the hpde, and return to home again wheels and tires. I have the set on the car plus a spare of the same wheel and tire, just in case. I had Falken 615 Azenis on before I got these, but the Neo Gens seem to be doing a better job, especially in rain. I have had no problems clearing the Carousel or the Keyhole at Mid-Ohio regarding clearing speeds. They do not seem to be overly overheating. The only problem I have ever had was once when I didn't take a lap to heat them up before trying to clear the Keyhole at speed...yup...slid right off the course...never again, nor since. With that in mind, I yield the floor to BThayer, who knows a helluva lot more about speed/weather tolerances than I ever shall.
Ah thanks for clarifying, I misunderstood how you were using them. I appreciate the feedback, I think a better way of phrasing my question is a setup that is fast in the rain and fun in the dry (fast in the dry is taken care off with the nt01s) The neogens should comparable to the contis i was looking at with the bonus that they come in more useful sizes!
The Neo Gens have a higher treadwear rating than the Azenzis [280 to 180]. I was a bit leery at first with the Azenzis, because I wanted a tire that could go to the track and back home again. I was surprised that they lasted thru 3summers and a trip to MOTD. They were great in dry and I thought they would be ok in wet, but they made me slide around a lot. So, I went looking around and noticed BlimeyCabrio's take on the Neo Gens. I liked what he had to say and bought a set. They are good in dry AND wet, at least for me at Mid-Ohio, and with the higher treadwear, seem to be wearing minimally. I run the lightest stock MINI wheels only...the 15" holeys and the 16" v-spokes.
Back in my autocrossing an road racing days, we always dropped the pressures by a couple of pounds in the wet. Our thoughts were this acted to help reduce suspension stiffness making the car more likely to be smoother and hopefully keep better traction.
Thanks for the input I have heard all three schools of thought on the wet tire pressure debate and I can see the reasoning for each. I have been running them a couple psi higher to help them get warm as my springs are softer than most at ~300lbs. We actually had a discussion at the last event about this with a big group of folks and everyone had a different experience lol The head instructors were running the same wet and dry cold psi but had vettes with stiff springs so differences wouldn't be unreasonable. I talked to a few of the w2w in my region and most of them use the conti dw if they aren't springing for Hoosier wets, but again these are gts, spec3, spec e30, sm, ssm guys so no fwd where maybe you can get away with something more aggressive.... my star specs should last the rest of the season unless it rains at every event so I should have all of winter to double guess myself but then the dw are on clearance right now arghhhhh
WOW can't believe I didn't think of that. The HC field is pretty small in my region but one of my best instructors from when I was a newbie races in that! In fact having similar cars might be why he was so helpful. He will be at the next event too. Thanks for helping me not a be a total space cadet lol!