Since we've beaten the TrueCar thing to death, let's try this...Most of my car purchases have been quick and painless--the MINI, for example, was purchased at a time where it was MSRP or bust. Got a tiny bit off, and a few extras thrown in, but that's it. One of the first cars we bought gets most memorable. We were shopping for a new Honda Civic, many, many years ago when we were still young (we had a Conestoga wagon as a trade in, not in the best of condition, one of the horses had thrown a shoe), and pinching every penny. First place we went to was a volume dealer, who proceeded to tell us the sticker price was the price we paid, nothing more, nothing less, then tried to explain to me that the sticker was the dealer invoice. Huh? Then how do you make money? The service fee. Um, ok, nice try, thank you for playing, let's not bother with a test drive here, moving on... So the second dealer, much more pleasant, get a young salesman. We go on the test drive, my wife and I in front, him in the back seat, and he doesn't know the car all that great, and proceeds to go on and on about how the Civic has a rear defrogger, and other cars in it's class like the Corolla don't have rear defroggers--which was a HUGE selling point for us; the frog plague that year was no joke, and anything that could protect us from those pesky tailless amphibians attacking our car, well, that was big plus. My wife wouldn't even look at me after he said that, she was afraid we'd both bust out laughing... We get back to the dealership, and start talking numbers, I give him mine, and say if you can do this we're good to go. And he looks at me and says, "So how much do you think our dealership should make on one of these?" And I replied, "Let's say you need your kidney out. How much should I make for taking care of that for you?" Blank stare. 30 seconds of uncomfortable silence. Then he blurts out, "Well, I asked you first..." I started laughing hysterically, almost wet myself I found it so funny. Then he starts laughing hysterically, and finally we calm down, everyone in the building is now staring at us, and ask him to run the numbers by his manager, I know the numbers are reasonable, if they don't work for you just give me a yes or a no and we'll move on either way. So he goes and comes back with a yes, and they'll throw in some mats and stuff on top of it, which was very cool, I didn't ask for them. They probably figured by the looks of the Conestoga we couldn't afford them. The young salesman grabs me later after we've signed everything and says, "Man, I'm so glad that worked out, I'm brand new here and I thought all that laughing was gonna get me in trouble." I hope he did well, my wife and I will never forget it.
My MINI was the first car I'd purchased from a dealer of any kind. It was real easy. The experience was good. All my other cars were bought through classified adds or from friends.
Not a buying story, but one from the other side of the desk..... Under the "there's an ass for every seat" rule. I was the sales manager at a big Porsche dealership and I had ordered a white 944 with a red interior - red interiors were rare on anything in the mid '80's so I thought by having something unique it would sell better. When the car came in it was awful - it had nice red seats, but almost everything else in the car, carpets, door cards etc were black! The car sat and sat, I was almost to the point of having the seats recovered in black to sell the car, when he walked in...... The fellow said he was a preacher, and that day he was wearing....... wait for it.................... A pair of black pants, a red shirt and a white sports coat! I walked him straight back to that car, his eyes lit up and an hour later he drove it home...........at sticker! :biggrin5:
Another story..... One of my salesmen had driven home a used car one Sat evening, and he and the bride went out and met friends for dinner, but they parked someplace they shouldn't have and when they came out later the car was gone. He thought it had been stolen and we turned it in to the insurance co. A week later the police called asking if that particular red car belonged to us (as it had our dealer plate on it). Turns out it had just been towed and had been sitting in their tow lot ever since. I made him go bail it out on his dime, but that's not really the story......his wife had left a pan of lasagna in the back seat and it was summer.....after 5 days the car was .................well...............ripe doesn't exactly cover it - that cheese had turned and it smelled like vomit. I had the best detailer in the city work on it, we even left it parked in the back lot with the doors open for a week but it was still rank. I told the guy if he couldn't find a buyer by the end of the month he was going to own it. Then he walked in..................... This guy had the worst cold I'd ever seen, and he was looking for a red one. The salesman took him straight to that car and an hour later he was an owner, and got a great deal on it! Never saw or heard from him again, I don't know if his cold cleared up or he just thought they all smelled like that, but we never got a complaint. Ass for every seat, like I said.......
That reminds me of this, recently posted on a track website: one of the salesman at a dealership took one of the dealerships cars to the track (and didn't take the dealer plates off; many people do take their plates off on street cars on the track for slightly devious reasons), and totalled it. He wasn't concerned about the car, just getting the plates off the car. At which point the police were called....
I've had a few customers total cars too. One Sunday afternoon this nice couple comes in to look at a 944 Turbo. The salesman and the hubby went out for a test run.....an hour or so later, the wife was standing around in the showroom asking "Do test drives always take this long?" About an half an hour later the tow truck showed up with the salesman and her hubby..... He lost it, rolled it sideways off a soft shoulder. His insurance co. paid for it, but he did not get a new Porsche - ever!
My wife had a XJS it was a beautiful car black with gray interior and had the factory wire rims. The only problem was it was starting to have a lot of small problems. We were young with one child so we couldn't even afford to buy small parts for it. Heres a list of problems it had; it needed a power steering hose that cost $100 or $150, the speedo did not always work, the AC would at odd times decide to go to full hot we lived in Florida, The seams on the leather seats were coming undone, and the nice black paint job had spider cracks all in it. My wife was about to have out second child so it was time for a mini van. The Ford dealer had a brand new one that was last years model so it was marked way down. I took the Jag and had the seats re-steched for $50 bucks. Then used polish with black die in it and waxed it. You could hardly see the spider cracks. I filled the power steering up with fluid and headed to the dealer. The I puled on the lot they surrounded the Jag, it did look good. Several salesmen commented how they would love to have it. The sales manger asked to drive it so we went for a ride. Th AC worked great so did the speedo. He asked about the milage I told him it was a little off because the speedo some times would not work, he said he did not care. I was truthful when asked a question but other than that I kept my mouth shut. I don't remember the price they gave me but I was floored it was way above what I hoped for, they even came down more on the price of the van. The next day the manager called mad about the power steering leak. I told him that he had the opportunity to look it over, drive it and ask questions. I had answered and he chose not to look under it or under the hood. For some reason he hung up on me.
Then there was this guy..... He drove up in a clapped out Ford Escort with faded paint and a distinct list to one side, he was rumpled and disheveled looking and looked like he didn't have two dimes to rub together. He also weighed 430 lbs, which probably had a lot to do with the Escort's list to port...... All my salesmen suddenly had something else to do so I welcomed him to the dealership and started a conversation as he walked straight over to the red 944 on the showroom floor. I knew he wouldn't fit, and so did he but he looked long and hard at it for a good 20 min while I answered his questions. Finally, he told me he'd started a doctor controlled diet that morning and when he hit his target weight he'd be in to buy that car. I'd seen plenty of guys like this in my career, full of hopes and dreams, although they were usually fresh out of an Amway meeting but this guy was different somehow...... This was just after Jan 1st..... Later in July the same guy walked into my showroom weighing 220 lb! We picked out a red 944 and he wrote me a check for it - turned out he was a divorce lawyer with a surprisingly good practice. He told stories about how people would snicker when he walked into the courtroom and made rude remarks to his back..... He was a really nice fellow and we got to be good friends...in fact he handled a child support case for me, and won it too. In October of the same year he came back to the dealership and traded the red 944 for a new dark blue 911 coupe, this time he was wearing a Saville Row suit, had a fresh haircut and was looking great at 185lbs. He'd lost a whole person in weight in 10 months!
Part II Sadly that was the beginning of his troubles....he'd married his high school sweetheart (they were still together up till now) but now that he was no longer such a lump, her insecurities came on strong, and she started imagining him having affairs and leaving her. A year later she left him.... He was devastated and within a year after the divorce he was back over 300....I ran into him on the street - he had a new girlfriend and still had the 911, business was good (he had a unique practice, he only took men as clients. He said men just want to get it over with, where women want to make it hurt!) and he was slowly getting a handle on his emotions and eating.....
For most of my adult life, I bought new cars. Lot's of them. I was a pretty loyal GM customer, and every time I wanted a new car, I just got my self pumped up for the marathon arse-whipping I was going to have to endure to get a reasonable price on my new car. In 1999, my wife was due for a new car, and had always dreamed of owning a Mercedes. So, I said, "Let's go and at least look at a Mercedes. We went to Park Place Mercedes, and as usual, I was armed with research, and ready to do battle. We found the car she wanted, and we sat in the salesman's office, while he gathered up the paperwork. When he came back, he put a price in front of me, and I was shocked. It was the price I was prepared to except after five hours of BS. The salesman saw my surprise, and said "We know are customers are smart people who do their homework, so we don't waste time getting to where we would eventually end up, anyway." Wow! In 2000, I bought myself my first Audi, and the experience was the same. I ended up buying my 2003 Audi from the same salesman. And, THAT is why a GOOD dealership doesn't fart around. They don't want to sell you "A" car. They want to sell you a bunch of cars. Carl Sewell, who owns sever high-end car dealerships, and the MINI dealership that services my car flat out tells his employees that he wants to sell his customers EVERY car they buy for the rest of their lives. I bought my MINI used from a Mazda dealer, and Sewell MINI treats my like I am their best customer. CD
Ah, the appearances thing...A few years ago, I was looking for something nice at a fairly expensive independent jewelry store in Appleton, about 45 minutes where I live. It's my day off, a Monday, and I'm dressed in a pair of old, comfortable jeans and a Life is Good T-shirt. Now I'm not crazy wealthy or anything, but I've been working long enough that I can afford something nice for my wife on the rare occasions that she deserves it, which on this occasion was Christmas. So I go into this renowned jewelry store, and saunter over to the diamond necklaces and earrings. And initially I'm being ignored for other customers, except for the occasional look out of the corner of the eye by the owner's (husband and wife), probably to make sure I'm not going to break through the display case and pinch something. It clears out to the point that one of them (him) finally comes over, and tries to gently steer me away from the diamond case to the cheaper semi-precious stones case, telling me I'd probably be more interested in that. No, I'd really like to take a look at a couple of the necklaces. And I get back a "Well, I think you might want to look at this first." At that point, a friend of mine, a physician who lives in Appleton, happens to walk into the store, a one in a million coincidence. The owner's wife immediately goes over to him, says "hello Scott, shopping for your wife for Christmas?" Fairly obvious he's shopped there before and they know him well. And he sees me, comes over and says hello with a big handshake, we talk for a minute or to about shopping for our wives, and the owners are taking this in. Scott says something to the effect of "take good care of him (me), he's up from Fond du Lac." At which point her husband immediately opens the diamond case and starts bringing a few pieces out. I laughed and said no thanks, I'm a little strapped for time now, I've been in here for awhile, and got the hell out of there. We still laugh about it whenever we run into each other...
Back in the early 70's I bought a 1967 Lotus Elan S/E. I had it so bad for that car I wouldn't have cared if there was a dead body in the trunk, well a very small dead body. Anyway reality set in a couple of years later, the whole thing was a very good learning experience. I tried very hard not to make stupid mistakes again (sort of succeeded!).
I've got 2 dealer stories. First one which most all of them do and it annoys me to death.. I test drive a used wrangler and they test drive my trade-in and one of the first things the salesman asks is "where do you want your payment" to which my answer is "as low as possible" After a couple of back and forths of that I finally told the guy if you can get it down to $150 I'll take 2 of them.. The sales guy in the next cubical almost fell out of his seat, he actually leaned around and gave me the thumbs up as my salesman when back to talk to his people.. Second story. On a Mitsubishi lot. Manager takes keys to my trade to check it out and salesman takes me to front lawn where his car is sitting to take me on a test drive. I'm in passenger seat and he cranks the car and is going over this that and the other on it's options etc. He gets out to run in and get a tag to put on it. I sit there for bout 10-15 minutes and get out leave car running and both doors open, and walk back inside. I walk over to sales manger desk to ask for my keys and he says well what do you think of it. I said I don't know we never left the front lawn with it. Sales guy came inside and left me out there and I haven't seen him since and by the way your car is still running out there and I left..
I'll do one at a time. It was spring '93 I wanted a new car. A coupe and ti had to be American made since I called on US manufacturers. I had a great deal on a left over '92 Probe GT. When my mom saw it she want one too. She had an old Sable. I told her there was 1 '92 left at the dealer and it was red. So we went to the dealer. She checked out the car and loved it. It was loaded and stickered at $18k. I told the sale guy let make a deal and she'll write you a check. After a little back and forth. I just told him go take this to the boss $10k out the door everything included. The owner came back he was about my age and just bought the dealer from his dad. Introductions were made. He asked what I was trying to do. I told him I was trying to get rid of his left over inventory that he'd already lost money on AND that car was going to keep sitting there because the new model was on the lot. He looked at my for a few minutes, then said fine write it up. My mom drive home very happy.
Friend of mine got a Pontiac Crossfire (ugh..) for next to nothing--they built too many of them, and by some freak of nature, like a thousand of them were misplaced in an overflow lot in Florida, and it wasn't discovered until after they were out of production (which in a nutshell explains why Chrysler ran itself into the ground). A friend of his was a dealer and told him about it, and that Chrysler was trying to get rid of them through their dealers any way they could; he went ahead and bought it site unseen for pennies on the dollar. He enjoyed it for the price...
So now you know how I got my wife's Ford minivan here is how I got rid of it. The van was long in the tooth. It was late fall the ac had quit so it was time for a new care for my wife. We now had 4 kids so I traded my pickup up for a Suberban. I was now driving a minivan, purgatory for a car guy. I saw a 328is on a dealer lot so I stopped and drove it. Went back to make a deal. They said 300 and the van I said no you give me 300 and the BMW. The sales manager said no your AC does not work, I said your car needs a wheel baring. He laughed and said he would flip me for the 300. I told him I did not like the odds, he said its 50/50 what's not to like. I told him when 300 was on the line I wanted better odds. I told him lets trade keys and be done with it. He was fine with that but said you have to give me $15 for a drive out tag. I laughed and said no the temp tag was part of the deal. That car brought me to BMW, I traded it for a convertable 328is, man I loved that car. It was an 86. I traded it for my 02 mini in 04. The sails manager gave me 2 grand for it. I saw him a few years later, he had left the Mini dealer but was still driving my old BMW. I was glad it went to a good home.
For another one. It was Christmas eve day and I took my sister car shopping. She had totaled her car the week before. My dad was loaning her the money until the insurance settled up. We looked at a number car and finally settled on a Mercury Tracer, Mazda Protege. Dad's condition of the loan it had to be American, he wasn't a car guy. It was late afternoon and the dealer's sales people wanted to get to the Christmas party. We sat down at the desk, the sales guy wrote it up. I change his number to something stupidly low but not insulting. He looked unhappy because it said this deal was going to take a while. He went to the boss and came back about 15 minutes later all smiles and said "Merry Christmas". The boss signed deal. The next day as my dad, sister and I talked it over I grumbled I didn't go low enough.
I grumbled I didn't go low enough And this is exactly why the back and forth has to happen, because if you simply sell the car for what the customer is asking they feel like they got screwed!:crazy: It's the stupidest way to do business. IMO.
I don't. I know what I'm willing to pay after doing a bit of research. I know (usually) I can get it a little lower than what I'll throw out there, but once the numbers are reasonable, I'll accept them, be happy, and move on. Like I said, I don't haggle. It's take it or leave it, I'd rather pay a little more to a good dealer than pull my hair out over a hundred bucks; you just can't unrealistically lowball if you do it. I've actually had more than a few salespeople say they don't mind people doing the math up front, it makes it easier on them than haggling back and forth. Like I said before, on this last car, I got the numbers I wanted and made a handshake deal over the phone. I got it lower than most, but not as low as some, I'm good with that. A dealer that I had contacted earlier with the exact same offer contacted me 2 days after I had accepted the deal, and came in slightly lower after they knew I had a deal at the other dealer. I didn't take it. If the dealer works with me in good faith, I won't turn around and screw them. That's why if you go in with a number you're happy with, it's so much easier than getting all pissed off negotiating, but that's just me. If I want to barter, I go to Mexico.
Don't get me wrong I got a great deal on the car for my sister. It's just sometimes things are too easy. On my wife's latest car we contacted all the dealers in the area to see what they had. The ones that had the car we wanted we talked to on the phone or over email. If they were a little resistant I explained that I just bought a car from Dallas the year before and had it shipped up, so if I got the right deal I'd come get it. A number of them, not all, put their best foot forward. I had the best offer from a dealer in Newark on a red one. My wife really wanted the screaming yellow. There were only 2 in town. One at a dealer I new would talk and one that happened to be close to home. We went in to talk I told them I had a good offer from dealer on a red one but she wanted the yellow one. Theirs had the nav which I didn't care about. So I told them I take their's for the same number as the red one or I'd just go get it. 15 minutes later we had the deal. I got the new car for what used ones were selling for. It was easy and I'm happy.